Sunday, February 29, 2004
(#210) (No rating)
by MTS (MTS at forclark dot com) on 02/29/2004 09:35:25 AM EST
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GOP rips Matheson over missed vote
Scheduling problem kept him from voting in Utah primary
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,595045846,00.html
"Reynolds said in a press release, "He didn't have a plane to catch when he cast his very first vote in (this) Congress for Nancy Pelosi for speaker of the House -- one of the most liberal members in Congress."
Noting Matheson had been among the first to endorse Wesley Clark for the Democratic nomination, Reynolds added that "he didn't blame a flight when saying he would cast his vote for Wesley Clark over President Bush -- the same Wesley Clark who didn't even rule out abortion in the final month of pregnancy, who was 'uneasy' about the death penalty and supports gay marriage."
The Republicans don't miss a chance to still get in digs at Clark... and look how they distort his views to attack him.
by MTS (MTS at forclark dot com) on 02/29/2004 09:35:25 AM EST
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GOP rips Matheson over missed vote
Scheduling problem kept him from voting in Utah primary
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,595045846,00.html
"Reynolds said in a press release, "He didn't have a plane to catch when he cast his very first vote in (this) Congress for Nancy Pelosi for speaker of the House -- one of the most liberal members in Congress."
Noting Matheson had been among the first to endorse Wesley Clark for the Democratic nomination, Reynolds added that "he didn't blame a flight when saying he would cast his vote for Wesley Clark over President Bush -- the same Wesley Clark who didn't even rule out abortion in the final month of pregnancy, who was 'uneasy' about the death penalty and supports gay marriage."
The Republicans don't miss a chance to still get in digs at Clark... and look how they distort his views to attack him.
(#218) (No rating)
by JoanM (
I saw this a few days ago and again today in an article in the Newspaper:
It is a great quote from Max Cleland: ...regarding Ed Gillespie, who did not serve in the military, to criticize Kerry, who was wounded three time ins Vietnam,
"is like a mackerel in the moonlight - it both shines and stinks at the same time"
by JoanM (
I saw this a few days ago and again today in an article in the Newspaper:
It is a great quote from Max Cleland: ...regarding Ed Gillespie, who did not serve in the military, to criticize Kerry, who was wounded three time ins Vietnam,
"is like a mackerel in the moonlight - it both shines and stinks at the same time"
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4224452/
Gibson was interviewed by the Herald Sun in Australia, and the reporter asked the star if Protestants are denied eternal salvation. “There is no salvation for those outside the Church,” Gibson replied. “I believe it.”
He elaborated: “Put it this way. My wife is a saint. She’s a much better person than I am. Honestly. She’s, like, Episcopalian, Church of England. She prays, she believes in God, she knows Jesus, she believes in that stuff. And it’s just not fair if she doesn’t make it, she’s better than I am. But that is a pronouncement from the chair. I go with it.”
.Gibson also said in the interview that he was nearly suicidal before he made his controversial film. “I got to a very desperate place. Very desperate. Kind of jump-out-of-a-window kind of desperate,” he said in the interview. “And I didn’t want to hang around here, but I didn’t want to check out. The other side was kind of scary. And I don’t like heights, anyway. But when you get to that point where you don’t want to live, and you don’t want to die, it’s a desperate, horrible place to be. And I just hit my knees. And I had to use ‘The Passion of the Christ’ to heal my wounds.”
Gibson was interviewed by the Herald Sun in Australia, and the reporter asked the star if Protestants are denied eternal salvation. “There is no salvation for those outside the Church,” Gibson replied. “I believe it.”
He elaborated: “Put it this way. My wife is a saint. She’s a much better person than I am. Honestly. She’s, like, Episcopalian, Church of England. She prays, she believes in God, she knows Jesus, she believes in that stuff. And it’s just not fair if she doesn’t make it, she’s better than I am. But that is a pronouncement from the chair. I go with it.”
.Gibson also said in the interview that he was nearly suicidal before he made his controversial film. “I got to a very desperate place. Very desperate. Kind of jump-out-of-a-window kind of desperate,” he said in the interview. “And I didn’t want to hang around here, but I didn’t want to check out. The other side was kind of scary. And I don’t like heights, anyway. But when you get to that point where you don’t want to live, and you don’t want to die, it’s a desperate, horrible place to be. And I just hit my knees. And I had to use ‘The Passion of the Christ’ to heal my wounds.”
by Susan ClevelandOH
Good morning, Elizabeth--I know it's hard, but hang in there! One of the most beautiful (and powerful) things that has happened because of Wes is that he has drawn together this amazingly diverse group of people committed to common principles and higher standards--we ARE a force for building a better America, in many ways, shapes, and forms. Let's stick together and watch for the opportunities to present themselves.
Good morning, Elizabeth--I know it's hard, but hang in there! One of the most beautiful (and powerful) things that has happened because of Wes is that he has drawn together this amazingly diverse group of people committed to common principles and higher standards--we ARE a force for building a better America, in many ways, shapes, and forms. Let's stick together and watch for the opportunities to present themselves.
Saturday, February 28, 2004
(#19) (No rating)
by Vicky (Vicky at forclark dot com) on 02/28/2004 04:22:18 PM EST
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"Perhaps anxiety is inevitable during a family's first steps into a tough domain, but Wes Jr. says his parents are only being realistic. Already, two other generals have denounced Clark as a candidate: General Tommy Franks, the commander of the war in Iraq, and General Hugh Shelton, who served as chairman of the joint chiefs, each hammered at Clark's qualifications in vague but vehement statements. (Clark dismissed their comments as "army gossip.") If Wes Jr.s father loses the nomination battle because of further opaque character critiques, the general might have many fewer private-sector prospects. "I don't think it's a remote possibiity," Wes Jr. says, meaning a real one. "The Republicans destroy people, but we're willing to risk it." --from the Elle article, "Mucho Macho Wes Clark" 3/04
--The General risked more than lost income while he was campaigning. He risked future income potential as well.
Duty. Honor. Country.
by Vicky (Vicky at forclark dot com) on 02/28/2004 04:22:18 PM EST
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"Perhaps anxiety is inevitable during a family's first steps into a tough domain, but Wes Jr. says his parents are only being realistic. Already, two other generals have denounced Clark as a candidate: General Tommy Franks, the commander of the war in Iraq, and General Hugh Shelton, who served as chairman of the joint chiefs, each hammered at Clark's qualifications in vague but vehement statements. (Clark dismissed their comments as "army gossip.") If Wes Jr.s father loses the nomination battle because of further opaque character critiques, the general might have many fewer private-sector prospects. "I don't think it's a remote possibiity," Wes Jr. says, meaning a real one. "The Republicans destroy people, but we're willing to risk it." --from the Elle article, "Mucho Macho Wes Clark" 3/04
--The General risked more than lost income while he was campaigning. He risked future income potential as well.
Duty. Honor. Country.
And, guess what? She scores!!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=410 463&mesg_id=410463
liberalnurse (1000+ posts) Sat Feb-28-04 03:39 PM
Original message
Dean supporters may as well vote Dean Tuesday.
I have not seen so much negative Dean threads and posts today since Iowa. I have to vote Tuesday in Ohio. I may as well just vote Dean ....I definitely don't want to vote Kerry and all my Dean Meet-Up friends feel the same way. Its the Edwards vote that I was going to cast. I wish to thank the Edward supporters for keeping me on track.
Too many anti-Dean Edward posters here today.
Vote Dean March 2, 2004 in Ohio!
Aww, something I said?
robbedvoter (1000+ posts) Sat Feb-28-04 02:25 PM
Original message
To Dean supporters working for Edwards - Iowa memories
Mr. Positive?
Presidential Hopeful Edwards Prides Himself On Not Going Negative — But Document Is Hardly Positive
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/US/edwards_positive_040121.htm...
By Jake Tapper
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/US/edwards_positive_040121.htm...
snip
But ABCNEWS has obtained an official "John Edwards for President" precinct captain packet that includes myriad personal attacks for Edwards caucus-goers to make against his Democratic opponents, perhaps belying this claim.
The document — marked "CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEDGED" (sic) and "NOT FOR DISTRIBUTION" and signed by the senator — encourages Edwards supporters to tell undecided caucus-attendees that former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean is a "Park Avenue elitist from New York City" and say Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts has "the stale record of a Washington insider" and "has been a part of the failed Washington politics for too long."
snip
Other information in the packet slams Dean for balancing Vermont budgets "on the backs of the poor and sick," cites "another Kerry exaggeration," and goes after Clark for praising President Bush's "neo-conservative foreign policy team." more...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=410 463&mesg_id=410463
liberalnurse (1000+ posts) Sat Feb-28-04 03:39 PM
Original message
Dean supporters may as well vote Dean Tuesday.
I have not seen so much negative Dean threads and posts today since Iowa. I have to vote Tuesday in Ohio. I may as well just vote Dean ....I definitely don't want to vote Kerry and all my Dean Meet-Up friends feel the same way. Its the Edwards vote that I was going to cast. I wish to thank the Edward supporters for keeping me on track.
Too many anti-Dean Edward posters here today.
Vote Dean March 2, 2004 in Ohio!
Aww, something I said?
robbedvoter (1000+ posts) Sat Feb-28-04 02:25 PM
Original message
To Dean supporters working for Edwards - Iowa memories
Mr. Positive?
Presidential Hopeful Edwards Prides Himself On Not Going Negative — But Document Is Hardly Positive
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/US/edwards_positive_040121.htm...
By Jake Tapper
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/US/edwards_positive_040121.htm...
snip
But ABCNEWS has obtained an official "John Edwards for President" precinct captain packet that includes myriad personal attacks for Edwards caucus-goers to make against his Democratic opponents, perhaps belying this claim.
The document — marked "CONFIDENTIAL AND PRIVILEDGED" (sic) and "NOT FOR DISTRIBUTION" and signed by the senator — encourages Edwards supporters to tell undecided caucus-attendees that former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean is a "Park Avenue elitist from New York City" and say Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts has "the stale record of a Washington insider" and "has been a part of the failed Washington politics for too long."
snip
Other information in the packet slams Dean for balancing Vermont budgets "on the backs of the poor and sick," cites "another Kerry exaggeration," and goes after Clark for praising President Bush's "neo-conservative foreign policy team." more...
(#278) (Rated 5.00/1)
by TOTALLY COMMITTED on 02/28/2004 03:22:01 PM EST
Sybil... Two things are true:
(1) Bush has to go. There is no one on this Blog that thinks 4 more yeears of his "government" is acceptable. Wes has said his #1 Goal is to see that government gone. Can we all agree about that?
(2) We respect and admire Wesley CLark. There is not one person on this Blog who would not feel a pang of sadness, but whole-heartedly "release" him to go back to a private life if he told us that's what he wanted. Can we all agree about that?
Knowing this man as I do, I believe we are sparring over a moot point. He will not go back to private life with Bush still in office. He just won't. I don't see it.
Everything that we know about him says he hates to lose. That he fights to win. He wants Bush gone. He paid a HUGE SACRIFICE to try and do it himself. I sincerely believe he is going NOWHERE until Bush is out of office.
If he is shown evidence that the surest way for Kerry to win is for him to be on the ticket, and Kerry asks him, the Wes I know will be on that ticket.
Why are we all sparring and sniping at each other over what WE want? If we all got what WE wanted Wes would still be in the race -- at least until after this Tuesday. He doesn't operate that way. Heh's a GENERAL. He DOES WHAT HE SEES FIT. No one on this blog will make him do anything he doesn't want to do.
So... all this is a difference of opinions. After all these months, are we going to come arpart over this? I don't think so.
by TOTALLY COMMITTED on 02/28/2004 03:22:01 PM EST
Sybil... Two things are true:
(1) Bush has to go. There is no one on this Blog that thinks 4 more yeears of his "government" is acceptable. Wes has said his #1 Goal is to see that government gone. Can we all agree about that?
(2) We respect and admire Wesley CLark. There is not one person on this Blog who would not feel a pang of sadness, but whole-heartedly "release" him to go back to a private life if he told us that's what he wanted. Can we all agree about that?
Knowing this man as I do, I believe we are sparring over a moot point. He will not go back to private life with Bush still in office. He just won't. I don't see it.
Everything that we know about him says he hates to lose. That he fights to win. He wants Bush gone. He paid a HUGE SACRIFICE to try and do it himself. I sincerely believe he is going NOWHERE until Bush is out of office.
If he is shown evidence that the surest way for Kerry to win is for him to be on the ticket, and Kerry asks him, the Wes I know will be on that ticket.
Why are we all sparring and sniping at each other over what WE want? If we all got what WE wanted Wes would still be in the race -- at least until after this Tuesday. He doesn't operate that way. Heh's a GENERAL. He DOES WHAT HE SEES FIT. No one on this blog will make him do anything he doesn't want to do.
So... all this is a difference of opinions. After all these months, are we going to come arpart over this? I don't think so.
I went to see John Kerry today...
Reply-To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
and all I got was a lousy Kerry pin and stood 2 hours in line. I did not see Kerry, although I got to a 7:00 p.m. event at 6:00 p.m.....and stood in line from 6:00 until 8:00 p.m. I did get to talk about Clark a lot in line. The people behind me were former Clark people. The people in front of me were former Clark people. Everywhere I looked I saw Clark people...with Kerry buttons on.
Never again will I make this attempt
Reply-To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
and all I got was a lousy Kerry pin and stood 2 hours in line. I did not see Kerry, although I got to a 7:00 p.m. event at 6:00 p.m.....and stood in line from 6:00 until 8:00 p.m. I did get to talk about Clark a lot in line. The people behind me were former Clark people. The people in front of me were former Clark people. Everywhere I looked I saw Clark people...with Kerry buttons on.
Never again will I make this attempt
Friday, February 27, 2004
From: Tyrus Gordon
Date: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:35:18 PM America/Montreal
To: clarkactionteam@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [clarkactionteam] Kerry Meet-Up Boston
Well I attended the Kerry Meet-up in Boston last night. It was an interesting little event. I was suprised to see that they had a smaller turnout than was typical for Clark meet-ups. There were 4 of us Clarkies there with Clark04 pins on. We wanted to state that where the General goes we go and they were very receptive to that. They seemed rather excited when I said that the majority of the Clark supporters are now throwing their weight behind Kerry. The person running the meet-up was a Kerry Senior Aide and he had never hosted a meet-up before and really didn't know what to expect. I told him that I had hosted several for the Clark campaign and he seemed very interested in what I had to say. After the meet-up, he jokingly told me that he should have pulled me aside before it began to ask me for some pointers.
I told him that I have to follow my heart and vote for Clark on Tuesday but after that I am more than willing to help out with the Kerry effort. He asked me to come meet with him in the Boston office some time to talk ahout how I can help out. All in all they seemed to be impressed with the grassroots support that we put together although I get the impression that they didn't really seem to understand that I was not planted there by the campaign and that I really was just a concerned citizen who up until a few months ago was not involved politically and just took some initiative. I am glad to see that they seem genuinly excited to see us throw our support to Kerry and I am excited at the opportunity (and that I won't be hanged for supporting someone other than the native son at first). I just may find it hard innitially to walk into that office and see a bunch of non-Clark signs all over the place.
Tyrus Gordon
Boston
Date: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:35:18 PM America/Montreal
To: clarkactionteam@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [clarkactionteam] Kerry Meet-Up Boston
Well I attended the Kerry Meet-up in Boston last night. It was an interesting little event. I was suprised to see that they had a smaller turnout than was typical for Clark meet-ups. There were 4 of us Clarkies there with Clark04 pins on. We wanted to state that where the General goes we go and they were very receptive to that. They seemed rather excited when I said that the majority of the Clark supporters are now throwing their weight behind Kerry. The person running the meet-up was a Kerry Senior Aide and he had never hosted a meet-up before and really didn't know what to expect. I told him that I had hosted several for the Clark campaign and he seemed very interested in what I had to say. After the meet-up, he jokingly told me that he should have pulled me aside before it began to ask me for some pointers.
I told him that I have to follow my heart and vote for Clark on Tuesday but after that I am more than willing to help out with the Kerry effort. He asked me to come meet with him in the Boston office some time to talk ahout how I can help out. All in all they seemed to be impressed with the grassroots support that we put together although I get the impression that they didn't really seem to understand that I was not planted there by the campaign and that I really was just a concerned citizen who up until a few months ago was not involved politically and just took some initiative. I am glad to see that they seem genuinly excited to see us throw our support to Kerry and I am excited at the opportunity (and that I won't be hanged for supporting someone other than the native son at first). I just may find it hard innitially to walk into that office and see a bunch of non-Clark signs all over the place.
Tyrus Gordon
Boston
182) (Rated 5.00/1)
by InTheTank4Clark (inthetank@forclark.com) on 02/27/2004 09:54:19 PM EST
You're right Sybil - if the nominee were an outsider like Clark or Dean. But Kerry has been in the Senate for many moons. He already knows where all the bodies are buried. I actually think the best VP for Kerry is... Kerry. And the best president for Kerry is Clark.
But I digress...
by InTheTank4Clark (inthetank@forclark.com) on 02/27/2004 09:54:19 PM EST
You're right Sybil - if the nominee were an outsider like Clark or Dean. But Kerry has been in the Senate for many moons. He already knows where all the bodies are buried. I actually think the best VP for Kerry is... Kerry. And the best president for Kerry is Clark.
But I digress...
[new] (#198) (No rating)
by Sybil (Clark Democrat) on 02/27/2004 05:36:06 PM EST
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Guys, I'm old enuf to have seen quite a number of good-looking men in my lifetime. In fact, I was married to a good-looking man, really. And let me tell you, john edwards really isn't the good-looking man you been led to believe he is.
Aside from his second head, he hasn't much of a jaw line. In fact, it's rather a weak jawline and not much chin at all really.
Now, in all reality, Wes Clark as the jawline for all times, as well as a really strong chin.
Kerry, well Kerry is all chin...don't know what that means...exactly...
by Sybil (Clark Democrat) on 02/27/2004 05:36:06 PM EST
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Guys, I'm old enuf to have seen quite a number of good-looking men in my lifetime. In fact, I was married to a good-looking man, really. And let me tell you, john edwards really isn't the good-looking man you been led to believe he is.
Aside from his second head, he hasn't much of a jaw line. In fact, it's rather a weak jawline and not much chin at all really.
Now, in all reality, Wes Clark as the jawline for all times, as well as a really strong chin.
Kerry, well Kerry is all chin...don't know what that means...exactly...
(#184) (Rated 5.00/3)
by TOTALLY COMMITTED on 02/27/2004 05:22:42 PM EST
BREAKING NEWS
John Edwards "Most Important" Feature...
In a stunning announcement just moments ago, John Edwards decided to tell America about what's most on the electorate's mind whenever they look at him, and consider him for VP. Most people think of his glossy, well-coifed hair, but he just pleaded with us to notice what's important about him.
"As you know I'm the son of a mill-worker", he told the crowd, "But I've been blessed in a way that few other people have. Let me tell you about what I believe is the most important reason to urge John Kerry to choose me as his VP... I've just found out that the mole on my lip is no ordinary growth. It was getting bigger and bigger, so I took some valuable time away from campaigning yesterday to have it looked at. I would like to tell you the good news. I AM GROWING A SECOND HEAD!"
He went on to explain to the stunned crowd that the growth on his lip was indeed a second head. Doctors, he said, assured him it would be fullt grown by the Democratic National Convention.
"I will be able to talk out of both sides of my face by then. Think about how important that will be against the Republicans! And, if it's anywhere NEAR as good-looking as my first face, I'll be twice as handsome as I was before -- a genuine two-for-one deal!"
As if an after thought, he then explained to the crowd that, even though the second head would be brainless, it would be smarter than George Bush, "I can assure you that my brainless head could win a debate with George Bush any day of the week!"
Reminded that it would be Dick Cheney he would be debating, Edwards said, "Well, at least it'll be better looking that Cheney, and just as two-faced. So, I still say, I'm the darned best VP candidate out there."
Speaking from California by phone, John Kerry was asked about whether having two heads would be something he'd be looking for in his choice of VP, "Well, John's a good man, I like him. And, He's bound to have a great looking second head, but I'm thinking -- two heads... four stars... I may go with Wes Clark, anyway."
Link:
http://www.icantbelieveitsasecondhead.com/edwards/sheltonsboyfriend/bushlite/html
by TOTALLY COMMITTED on 02/27/2004 05:22:42 PM EST
BREAKING NEWS
John Edwards "Most Important" Feature...
In a stunning announcement just moments ago, John Edwards decided to tell America about what's most on the electorate's mind whenever they look at him, and consider him for VP. Most people think of his glossy, well-coifed hair, but he just pleaded with us to notice what's important about him.
"As you know I'm the son of a mill-worker", he told the crowd, "But I've been blessed in a way that few other people have. Let me tell you about what I believe is the most important reason to urge John Kerry to choose me as his VP... I've just found out that the mole on my lip is no ordinary growth. It was getting bigger and bigger, so I took some valuable time away from campaigning yesterday to have it looked at. I would like to tell you the good news. I AM GROWING A SECOND HEAD!"
He went on to explain to the stunned crowd that the growth on his lip was indeed a second head. Doctors, he said, assured him it would be fullt grown by the Democratic National Convention.
"I will be able to talk out of both sides of my face by then. Think about how important that will be against the Republicans! And, if it's anywhere NEAR as good-looking as my first face, I'll be twice as handsome as I was before -- a genuine two-for-one deal!"
As if an after thought, he then explained to the crowd that, even though the second head would be brainless, it would be smarter than George Bush, "I can assure you that my brainless head could win a debate with George Bush any day of the week!"
Reminded that it would be Dick Cheney he would be debating, Edwards said, "Well, at least it'll be better looking that Cheney, and just as two-faced. So, I still say, I'm the darned best VP candidate out there."
Speaking from California by phone, John Kerry was asked about whether having two heads would be something he'd be looking for in his choice of VP, "Well, John's a good man, I like him. And, He's bound to have a great looking second head, but I'm thinking -- two heads... four stars... I may go with Wes Clark, anyway."
Link:
http://www.icantbelieveitsasecondhead.com/edwards/sheltonsboyfriend/bushlite/html
(#113) (Rated 5.00/1)
by malatete on 02/27/2004 04:31:35 PM EST
All this talk of Chucky's magic lip got me thinking about Uncle Buck...cracking up here at my desk while hunting down this bit of dialogue. Enjoy!
"Hi, I'm Buck Melanoma, Maisy Russell's wart. Not her wart, not her wart. I'm her growth, her tumor, her melanoma. That's what they call me - melanomahead!"
by malatete on 02/27/2004 04:31:35 PM EST
All this talk of Chucky's magic lip got me thinking about Uncle Buck...cracking up here at my desk while hunting down this bit of dialogue. Enjoy!
"Hi, I'm Buck Melanoma, Maisy Russell's wart. Not her wart, not her wart. I'm her growth, her tumor, her melanoma. That's what they call me - melanomahead!"
(#53) (Rated 5.00/1)
by Robbedvoter (Robbedvoter at forclark dot com) on 02/27/2004 04:00:12 PM EST
Parent | Reply
kevin
I spend more time on CCN than you and anyone present here now. Look at the morning posts - it's just me updating the blog.
I worked hard in putting together a list where bloggers would feel welcome if CCN finished. It proved handy during the blackout. A lot of DU Clarkies who had switched to kerry avatars, came to our list and got their pride back and are now kicking ass on DU. We privided a fighting back spirit, proud atmosphere when others were giving up. That's what people like there. We fundraise and have action files there. Good things.
My invitation was not to entice you away from here - why would I? I am here. I don't understand the hostility. It wasn't an ego thing, just as Kbacon's wasn't.(he got needlessly insulted and attacked here as well) Why are there always people here ready to attack those who, in true Clark spirit create communities? Why the bile? Why are you feel threatened?
believe me: no blogger will be abducted to yahoo or Clarktopia and signed against their will and prohibited from coming here.
Sheesh! You'd think choice would be a good thing...
Imagine the panic you'll go in when I'll announce that someone is writing a book on Clark...How dare they!
by Robbedvoter (Robbedvoter at forclark dot com) on 02/27/2004 04:00:12 PM EST
Parent | Reply
kevin
I spend more time on CCN than you and anyone present here now. Look at the morning posts - it's just me updating the blog.
I worked hard in putting together a list where bloggers would feel welcome if CCN finished. It proved handy during the blackout. A lot of DU Clarkies who had switched to kerry avatars, came to our list and got their pride back and are now kicking ass on DU. We privided a fighting back spirit, proud atmosphere when others were giving up. That's what people like there. We fundraise and have action files there. Good things.
My invitation was not to entice you away from here - why would I? I am here. I don't understand the hostility. It wasn't an ego thing, just as Kbacon's wasn't.(he got needlessly insulted and attacked here as well) Why are there always people here ready to attack those who, in true Clark spirit create communities? Why the bile? Why are you feel threatened?
believe me: no blogger will be abducted to yahoo or Clarktopia and signed against their will and prohibited from coming here.
Sheesh! You'd think choice would be a good thing...
Imagine the panic you'll go in when I'll announce that someone is writing a book on Clark...How dare they!
(#29) (Rated 5.00/1)
by Anonymous on 02/27/2004 03:41:17 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Parent | Reply
kevin22262
I don't really understand roseba's issue, I guess. I saw several postings yesterday here about the response Clark was getting in California. The postings reported video and description on CNN.
I am not sure about whether roseba should "expect" this on the offical blog or not. I guess what roseba should expect to see here is whatever the bloggers collectively decide to post here. The blog may be official, but the content of the postings, whether individually or collectively, is in no sense official or representative of anything beyond that. It's a pretty good source for news about Clark, but it is highly variable and uneven in that regard. Some threads have more informational content than others and it changes from minute to minute. To find out everything you want to know you probably have to use Google News and/or Yahoo News and search using "Wesley Clark." And it doesn't hurt to check the other blogs. I have all these things bookmarked at work and just check around at odd times during the day. But we are obviously not an official clearinghouse for Clark news in any sense.
I'm not really sure what the question was getting at perhaps.
John in Houston
by Anonymous on 02/27/2004 03:41:17 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Parent | Reply
kevin22262
I don't really understand roseba's issue, I guess. I saw several postings yesterday here about the response Clark was getting in California. The postings reported video and description on CNN.
I am not sure about whether roseba should "expect" this on the offical blog or not. I guess what roseba should expect to see here is whatever the bloggers collectively decide to post here. The blog may be official, but the content of the postings, whether individually or collectively, is in no sense official or representative of anything beyond that. It's a pretty good source for news about Clark, but it is highly variable and uneven in that regard. Some threads have more informational content than others and it changes from minute to minute. To find out everything you want to know you probably have to use Google News and/or Yahoo News and search using "Wesley Clark." And it doesn't hurt to check the other blogs. I have all these things bookmarked at work and just check around at odd times during the day. But we are obviously not an official clearinghouse for Clark news in any sense.
I'm not really sure what the question was getting at perhaps.
John in Houston
Thanks Leah! This got me to laugh. I didn't see it til this morning,
a whole day later, but it has put a smile on my face to start the
day. Beckham, the ultimate verbal minimalist. In fact, this would
qualify as Japanese Haiku poetry. That "crap" at the end says it all
for me.
Margie A.
At 10:06 AM -0500 2/26/04, Leah Faerstein wrote:
by beckham
Well, it's come down to a choice of Bland and Blander.
John Doe or John D'oh.
Crap.
a whole day later, but it has put a smile on my face to start the
day. Beckham, the ultimate verbal minimalist. In fact, this would
qualify as Japanese Haiku poetry. That "crap" at the end says it all
for me.
Margie A.
At 10:06 AM -0500 2/26/04, Leah Faerstein wrote:
by beckham
Well, it's come down to a choice of Bland and Blander.
John Doe or John D'oh.
Crap.
Kramer
Exactly. Clark is obviously out campaigning now. A reporter asked him if he was doing that in order to become the VP candidate. The reporter was questioning his motives. Are you really doing this to support Kerry? Or, are you doing this out of self-interest? The answer was, "No. I'm not campaigning to be VP. I'm doing this to help get George Bush out of the White House."
John in Houston
Exactly. Clark is obviously out campaigning now. A reporter asked him if he was doing that in order to become the VP candidate. The reporter was questioning his motives. Are you really doing this to support Kerry? Or, are you doing this out of self-interest? The answer was, "No. I'm not campaigning to be VP. I'm doing this to help get George Bush out of the White House."
John in Houston
(#22) (Rated 5.00/1)
by Ocelot on 02/27/2004 10:32:15 AM EST
#9 I've always thought Howard Stern was creepy -- he seems to have the mentality of a desperate, nerdy, sex-obsessed 17-year-old who isn't getting any, and who keeps old issues of Hustler under his mattress. But if he's been dissing Bush, and manages to influence the other sex-obsesssed guys who listen to him, then more power to him.
by Ocelot on 02/27/2004 10:32:15 AM EST
#9 I've always thought Howard Stern was creepy -- he seems to have the mentality of a desperate, nerdy, sex-obsessed 17-year-old who isn't getting any, and who keeps old issues of Hustler under his mattress. But if he's been dissing Bush, and manages to influence the other sex-obsesssed guys who listen to him, then more power to him.
(#304) (Rated 5.00/2)
by Kramer (Kramer at forclark dot com) on 02/27/2004 10:11:16 AM EST
What was written by Sandi and some others yesterday about the General's remarks regarding not running was read in an entirely different way by me.
I read the actual article, and it was clear that the General was asked by the reporter if he was CAMPAIGNING for a VP or cabinent position...same questions he was asked when he was campaigning to be President.
His reply was only slightly modified: Did my public service, and now I am helping spread the message of beating George Bush.
He is simply rebuting that he has a personal agenda for doing what he is doing. Nothing more.
by Kramer (Kramer at forclark dot com) on 02/27/2004 10:11:16 AM EST
What was written by Sandi and some others yesterday about the General's remarks regarding not running was read in an entirely different way by me.
I read the actual article, and it was clear that the General was asked by the reporter if he was CAMPAIGNING for a VP or cabinent position...same questions he was asked when he was campaigning to be President.
His reply was only slightly modified: Did my public service, and now I am helping spread the message of beating George Bush.
He is simply rebuting that he has a personal agenda for doing what he is doing. Nothing more.
BIZZARO WORLD CHUCKLE
[clarkactionteam] Kerry Meetup in Houston
I was not able to attend the Kerry Meetup here last night, but one of
our Clark volunteers called me after he showed up at the announced
location only to find no meeting. Apparently, the restaurant where it
was to be held, and where it was held last time, told them they were no
longer welcome. I guess in January a bunch of people ordered large
amounts of food and left without paying for it. Needless to say, the
restaurant management was not happy.
But our volunteer received conflicting reports about where the meeting
relocated, and finally called me in frustration when he was unable to
find it.
[clarkactionteam] Kerry Meetup in Houston
I was not able to attend the Kerry Meetup here last night, but one of
our Clark volunteers called me after he showed up at the announced
location only to find no meeting. Apparently, the restaurant where it
was to be held, and where it was held last time, told them they were no
longer welcome. I guess in January a bunch of people ordered large
amounts of food and left without paying for it. Needless to say, the
restaurant management was not happy.
But our volunteer received conflicting reports about where the meeting
relocated, and finally called me in frustration when he was unable to
find it.
Zogby, whoring for Edwards
This, from an article in The New York Observer: "Despite a new Survey/USA poll showing him trailing in New York by 36 points, some political experts give him a real chance of pulling off a surprise. 'He's been attracting . . . rural and small-town voters with his message of two Americas,' said pollster John Zogby. 'He's also attractive to a lot of people simply because of the fact that he's 'the other candidate.' Mr. Zogby said he wouldn't be surprised if Mr. Edwards won New York."
I know Zogby has no credibility on this blog but is he on drugs?????? I hope statements like that come back to haunt him.
This, from an article in The New York Observer: "Despite a new Survey/USA poll showing him trailing in New York by 36 points, some political experts give him a real chance of pulling off a surprise. 'He's been attracting . . . rural and small-town voters with his message of two Americas,' said pollster John Zogby. 'He's also attractive to a lot of people simply because of the fact that he's 'the other candidate.' Mr. Zogby said he wouldn't be surprised if Mr. Edwards won New York."
I know Zogby has no credibility on this blog but is he on drugs?????? I hope statements like that come back to haunt him.
(#244) (Rated 5.00/1)
by Lynne
oh it's on joandarc's blog...edwards does not respect clark...this was a comment on that blog.
During one of the debates last year when they took questions from the audience, Edwards shoved General Clark to his seat when it was Edwards turn to talk. Edwards is a polished speaker, but he lost my respect when he did that (watching it closely it didn't look like a buddy doing it light-heartedly but someone with no class)
.Me:
Edwards is too self involved to respect anyone. here's an article that catches that well:
Here, Cripple! Here, Cripple!
Matt Grills
http://www.opinioneditorials.com/guestcontributors/grills_20040226.html
"
If John Kerry is in love with his status as war hero, Edwards suffers from "prom-king syndrome." You know the type - those guys who honestly believe they are better than everyone else. They aren't at all sure how to deal with those of us who don't have nice hair, nice teeth and nice smiles."
(The article is bitchy, obviously from a rightwinger - but this obeservation is on the nose. The event that prompted it - patting a woman in wheelchait on her head)
by Lynne
oh it's on joandarc's blog...edwards does not respect clark...this was a comment on that blog.
During one of the debates last year when they took questions from the audience, Edwards shoved General Clark to his seat when it was Edwards turn to talk. Edwards is a polished speaker, but he lost my respect when he did that (watching it closely it didn't look like a buddy doing it light-heartedly but someone with no class)
.Me:
Edwards is too self involved to respect anyone. here's an article that catches that well:
Here, Cripple! Here, Cripple!
Matt Grills
http://www.opinioneditorials.com/guestcontributors/grills_20040226.html
"
If John Kerry is in love with his status as war hero, Edwards suffers from "prom-king syndrome." You know the type - those guys who honestly believe they are better than everyone else. They aren't at all sure how to deal with those of us who don't have nice hair, nice teeth and nice smiles."
(The article is bitchy, obviously from a rightwinger - but this obeservation is on the nose. The event that prompted it - patting a woman in wheelchait on her head)
by Vicky (
Okay, so I'll talk to myself some. Went to bed but couldn't sleep. Have you ever tried counting politicians to fall asleep? Not smart! Probably a good way to get nightmares.
So, anyway, I start thinking about political things. And I'm thinking of that last question at the debate and Kerry's response. He WAS NOT enthusiastic about Edwards as a potential VP. When asked what qualities Edwards would bring to the table, he hemmed and hawed and finally replied that Edwards was charming and a great communicator - ah, a stab in the political heart - faint, damning praise - the political kiss of death! In other words, IMO, he said Edwards is a lightweight who would bring only superficial qualities. When pressed he said he admired and respected Edwards.
Contrast that with Kerry's words of praise for the General when the General endorsed him. And remember the look on his face and his demeanor with our man. Now pundits and pols say the VP has to "bring something to the table" and there is a lot of "horsetrading" going on. Various names have been floated as Kerry's potential VP, among them Gephardt. He's owed, it's felt, and he would bring the midwest. Well, some of the midwest is leaning Bush now according to in-the-field Clarkies and the CNN analysts. Problem is, Gephardt is not "charming" at all. A good, good man. But not charming. Lacking charm, in fact. Not good. Then we've heard Edwards (hope not!), Cleland (a possibility, though I think he would serve Kerry and himself better in another position), Graham (a little too old and quirky, though I adore him), Richardson (doesn't strike me as a president, not at all - any military experience)? Richardson could help in the southwest. And others, candidates that is.
Then there's Clark and we've discussed the qualities he'd bring to the table often! They are legion. But I was thinking of that CNN map shown on television today. Arkansas - leaning Bush. The General could change that - and that, in itself, could change the election IF Bush won all the states he won the last time around (well, I personally don't think he WON Florida!), with the exception of Arkansas, that might swing the election . But I also think a heavy medal Kerry-Clark ticket would do well in Arizona and Nevada, both leaning Bush There could be some additional surprises. Maybe even New Hampshire according to recent polls! More states in the south would be great, certainly. And there's a better chance of winning some there with Clark than Edwards once the primaries are over and we're voting BIG TIME, for real and for four years. So, IMO, there are some geographical advantages, among so very other advantages, to having Clark on the ticket.
That being said, I'm not going to hold my breath in anticipation. I know the General will do well, whatever he chooses to do. He's one helluva man!
This being said, and now out of MY MIND and onto the blog, I can leave it here and go to bed with an empty mind. I don't mean to imply I'm coming here to unload my trash! Well, I guess I've been guilty of that as well.
Okay, so I'll talk to myself some. Went to bed but couldn't sleep. Have you ever tried counting politicians to fall asleep? Not smart! Probably a good way to get nightmares.
So, anyway, I start thinking about political things. And I'm thinking of that last question at the debate and Kerry's response. He WAS NOT enthusiastic about Edwards as a potential VP. When asked what qualities Edwards would bring to the table, he hemmed and hawed and finally replied that Edwards was charming and a great communicator - ah, a stab in the political heart - faint, damning praise - the political kiss of death! In other words, IMO, he said Edwards is a lightweight who would bring only superficial qualities. When pressed he said he admired and respected Edwards.
Contrast that with Kerry's words of praise for the General when the General endorsed him. And remember the look on his face and his demeanor with our man. Now pundits and pols say the VP has to "bring something to the table" and there is a lot of "horsetrading" going on. Various names have been floated as Kerry's potential VP, among them Gephardt. He's owed, it's felt, and he would bring the midwest. Well, some of the midwest is leaning Bush now according to in-the-field Clarkies and the CNN analysts. Problem is, Gephardt is not "charming" at all. A good, good man. But not charming. Lacking charm, in fact. Not good. Then we've heard Edwards (hope not!), Cleland (a possibility, though I think he would serve Kerry and himself better in another position), Graham (a little too old and quirky, though I adore him), Richardson (doesn't strike me as a president, not at all - any military experience)? Richardson could help in the southwest. And others, candidates that is.
Then there's Clark and we've discussed the qualities he'd bring to the table often! They are legion. But I was thinking of that CNN map shown on television today. Arkansas - leaning Bush. The General could change that - and that, in itself, could change the election IF Bush won all the states he won the last time around (well, I personally don't think he WON Florida!), with the exception of Arkansas, that might swing the election . But I also think a heavy medal Kerry-Clark ticket would do well in Arizona and Nevada, both leaning Bush There could be some additional surprises. Maybe even New Hampshire according to recent polls! More states in the south would be great, certainly. And there's a better chance of winning some there with Clark than Edwards once the primaries are over and we're voting BIG TIME, for real and for four years. So, IMO, there are some geographical advantages, among so very other advantages, to having Clark on the ticket.
That being said, I'm not going to hold my breath in anticipation. I know the General will do well, whatever he chooses to do. He's one helluva man!
This being said, and now out of MY MIND and onto the blog, I can leave it here and go to bed with an empty mind. I don't mean to imply I'm coming here to unload my trash! Well, I guess I've been guilty of that as well.
Thursday, February 26, 2004
The RNC media didn't have it all.
Yes, they did manage to get rid of Clark, but think of it:
Their first choice was Joementum - and they tried their best.
Their second - Dean - mostly because the civil unions in Vermont.
As the Mass Court passed the gay marriage decision, Kerry was elevated, but you know their heart is set on Edwards - and THEY WON"T GET HIM either.
It just dawned on me when someone mentioned a wingnut article praising Joementum and Breck.
Yes, they did manage to get rid of Clark, but think of it:
Their first choice was Joementum - and they tried their best.
Their second - Dean - mostly because the civil unions in Vermont.
As the Mass Court passed the gay marriage decision, Kerry was elevated, but you know their heart is set on Edwards - and THEY WON"T GET HIM either.
It just dawned on me when someone mentioned a wingnut article praising Joementum and Breck.
)
by Vicky (Vicky at forclark dot com) on 02/26/2004 04:49:55 PM EST
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I don't have a lot of faith in the Democratic Party AT THE PRESENT MOMENT. And as much as I want a win in November, I figure it's a toss-up. But I know the General's performance history. He became respected and reknowned for taking on incompetent, lackadaisical units and building them into the finest performing units of their class/type. Now, I don't expect he's going to be taking over control of the Democratic Party. But I do think he is going to be very influential. He's paying his dues now, which the Democrats seem to expect and require (unlike Republicans would, as has been noted). I sincerely do believe they are going to begin paying more and more attention to him, listening to him, and incorporating his ideas (look how the party and the candidates have already done that in just six months!! - even when it is unconscious, they begin to absorb his ideas almost by osmosis!).
GENERAL CLARK WILL BE AN INSTRUMENTAL FORCE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND HE WILL LEAD CHANGE, REFORM, AND REINVORGORATION OF THE PARTY.
That's my take, anyway!
by Vicky (Vicky at forclark dot com) on 02/26/2004 04:49:55 PM EST
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I don't have a lot of faith in the Democratic Party AT THE PRESENT MOMENT. And as much as I want a win in November, I figure it's a toss-up. But I know the General's performance history. He became respected and reknowned for taking on incompetent, lackadaisical units and building them into the finest performing units of their class/type. Now, I don't expect he's going to be taking over control of the Democratic Party. But I do think he is going to be very influential. He's paying his dues now, which the Democrats seem to expect and require (unlike Republicans would, as has been noted). I sincerely do believe they are going to begin paying more and more attention to him, listening to him, and incorporating his ideas (look how the party and the candidates have already done that in just six months!! - even when it is unconscious, they begin to absorb his ideas almost by osmosis!).
GENERAL CLARK WILL BE AN INSTRUMENTAL FORCE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND HE WILL LEAD CHANGE, REFORM, AND REINVORGORATION OF THE PARTY.
That's my take, anyway!
)
by KayCeSF on 02/26/2004 11:03:26 AM EST
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OH MY GOD ... CNN! Morning folks! I just watched CNN and Bill Schneider had footage of huge crowds of people coming out in California for Wesley Clark! He stated that Clark is bringing out a lot of people for Kerry, and that Clark (not Kerry) is extremely popular in California, that he has a son that is a screen writer there who had done a lot of campaigning for his father, and "let's not forget that Madonna endorsed Wesley Clark", but the point is, Wesley Clark is really bringing out the people for Kerry. Then they showed more quick footage of Clark shaking people's hands in California. I said it on the blog last night, the more people meet, hear and see Clark, the more they are going to ask questions like, Why did he get out of the race so soon? Why didn't he get more coverage? Why did this amazing man get more votes? Why .. Why ... Why! Anyway, just had to share the news in case no one saw it. It was very exciting!
by KayCeSF on 02/26/2004 11:03:26 AM EST
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OH MY GOD ... CNN! Morning folks! I just watched CNN and Bill Schneider had footage of huge crowds of people coming out in California for Wesley Clark! He stated that Clark is bringing out a lot of people for Kerry, and that Clark (not Kerry) is extremely popular in California, that he has a son that is a screen writer there who had done a lot of campaigning for his father, and "let's not forget that Madonna endorsed Wesley Clark", but the point is, Wesley Clark is really bringing out the people for Kerry. Then they showed more quick footage of Clark shaking people's hands in California. I said it on the blog last night, the more people meet, hear and see Clark, the more they are going to ask questions like, Why did he get out of the race so soon? Why didn't he get more coverage? Why did this amazing man get more votes? Why .. Why ... Why! Anyway, just had to share the news in case no one saw it. It was very exciting!
(#88) (Rated 5.00/3)
THE END OF THE EMPIRE
by tracim
Okay, here's what we've got so far:
McDonalds is now considered a Manufacturing Plant.
Teachers are now considered Terrorists.
Fetuses have civil rights; homosexuals do not.
France is the Enemy; Libya is the Friend.
Wesley Clark is no longer running for president, Al Sharpton is; and George W. is actually currently presiding.
Ladies and Gentlemen, I believe we have reached the end of the empire.
THE END OF THE EMPIRE
by tracim
Okay, here's what we've got so far:
McDonalds is now considered a Manufacturing Plant.
Teachers are now considered Terrorists.
Fetuses have civil rights; homosexuals do not.
France is the Enemy; Libya is the Friend.
Wesley Clark is no longer running for president, Al Sharpton is; and George W. is actually currently presiding.
Ladies and Gentlemen, I believe we have reached the end of the empire.
by KnightRider (A CLARK Democrat!)
THE PRIMARIES: I had some conflicts about this myself, and I, personally, resolved it based on the convictions that got me to join the CLARK campaign. We all had different priorities, but we're all united on the same goal.
-If you chose to campaign with CLARK on "the ABB philosophy' or "electability factor", then your vote would be based on the principle of being a "strategic voter" for the Democratic Party.
-If you chose to campaign with CLARK on the principle of defining a higher standard of leadership for America within the Democratic Party, then your vote would be based on an ideal that we can call on,..and define a higher standard of leadership for America and the Presidency.
If you choose to vote for Kerry, it is with CLARK's blessing; but if you choose to vote for CLARK, then your voting towards a fundamental conviction and ideal,....which would not be voiced,.... unless stated concretely through your vote.
Wesley Clark's name is the first name on my ballot machine, to scroll down,... would violate the principle that "I chose" to support CLARK.
After the primaries, regardless of who you voted for,....we will have a "nominee"!
THE PRIMARIES: I had some conflicts about this myself, and I, personally, resolved it based on the convictions that got me to join the CLARK campaign. We all had different priorities, but we're all united on the same goal.
-If you chose to campaign with CLARK on "the ABB philosophy' or "electability factor", then your vote would be based on the principle of being a "strategic voter" for the Democratic Party.
-If you chose to campaign with CLARK on the principle of defining a higher standard of leadership for America within the Democratic Party, then your vote would be based on an ideal that we can call on,..and define a higher standard of leadership for America and the Presidency.
If you choose to vote for Kerry, it is with CLARK's blessing; but if you choose to vote for CLARK, then your voting towards a fundamental conviction and ideal,....which would not be voiced,.... unless stated concretely through your vote.
Wesley Clark's name is the first name on my ballot machine, to scroll down,... would violate the principle that "I chose" to support CLARK.
After the primaries, regardless of who you voted for,....we will have a "nominee"!
[new] (#271) (No rating)
by Sonoran Desert (CactusWren@Saguaro.com) on 02/26/2004 04:59:46 AM EST
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You prolly know I'm first gen American too.
And lots of other stuff in my past.
Fighting for justice, being in the Peace Corps, and all the rest has been so important in my life that I am torn apart inside as well.
I was born in Sydney NY, closest town with a hospital. Grew up all over the place. NY, Ohio, TN, IL, PA, and then more later.
I've said that it makes me feel like all that I have fought for has been for nothing if this continues (Dubya).
And g'night. Be talking to ya.
Chris
by Sonoran Desert (CactusWren@Saguaro.com) on 02/26/2004 04:59:46 AM EST
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You prolly know I'm first gen American too.
And lots of other stuff in my past.
Fighting for justice, being in the Peace Corps, and all the rest has been so important in my life that I am torn apart inside as well.
I was born in Sydney NY, closest town with a hospital. Grew up all over the place. NY, Ohio, TN, IL, PA, and then more later.
I've said that it makes me feel like all that I have fought for has been for nothing if this continues (Dubya).
And g'night. Be talking to ya.
Chris
(#22) (Rated 5.00/2)
by noelschutz (noelschutz@yahoo.com) on 02/26/2004 08:38:06 AM EST
Ironically, Clearsky, it would seem his little trip for Kerry to Georgia got more press than his whole Tennessee campaign! Well, not that bad, but he will be in the national consciousness now and he has worldwide name recognition. Anything he does, now that he is not worrying the powers that be as a presidential candidate, will get press. He will come out of this campaign smelling like flowers as he did not sully himself or compromise his principles. He set the intellectual tone of the whole campaign and gave the Democrates their "gravitas." We can be proud of him...
by noelschutz (noelschutz@yahoo.com) on 02/26/2004 08:38:06 AM EST
Ironically, Clearsky, it would seem his little trip for Kerry to Georgia got more press than his whole Tennessee campaign! Well, not that bad, but he will be in the national consciousness now and he has worldwide name recognition. Anything he does, now that he is not worrying the powers that be as a presidential candidate, will get press. He will come out of this campaign smelling like flowers as he did not sully himself or compromise his principles. He set the intellectual tone of the whole campaign and gave the Democrates their "gravitas." We can be proud of him...
Wednesday, February 25, 2004
[new] (#232) (No rating)
by Charlotte Sweden (Charlotte-Sweden at forclark dot com) on 02/25/2004 10:54:50 PM EST
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Kay, in view of the deep spiritual importance you too have detected about your general, here are some of my thoughts that I´d like to share with you:
I have a very strong feeling that we are standing at a crossroads - will we reject this marvelous gift from the Higher Power, or will we choose to go down the dark road? Frankly, I´m worried. People appear to be asleep. I could go on and on about this! One thing I definitely sense is that we who are reacting this strongly to the General and who are so powerfully drawn to him with, what it seems, a tremendous sense of love and undying devotion, we are all in his "soul-group" - it´s no coincidence we have now all come together again, drawn by the soul who is the General. I believe we have all been together before, and that we have all loved and served him before. We will not fail! But will the rest of humanity choose light or darkness? We can only offer the gift, not force anyone to receive it. But I do believe we are all Wesley Clark´s spiritual army, come together again in these times when the world is right at the crossroads.
"The will to do, the soul to dare". Wesley Clark.
by Charlotte Sweden (Charlotte-Sweden at forclark dot com) on 02/25/2004 10:54:50 PM EST
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Kay, in view of the deep spiritual importance you too have detected about your general, here are some of my thoughts that I´d like to share with you:
I have a very strong feeling that we are standing at a crossroads - will we reject this marvelous gift from the Higher Power, or will we choose to go down the dark road? Frankly, I´m worried. People appear to be asleep. I could go on and on about this! One thing I definitely sense is that we who are reacting this strongly to the General and who are so powerfully drawn to him with, what it seems, a tremendous sense of love and undying devotion, we are all in his "soul-group" - it´s no coincidence we have now all come together again, drawn by the soul who is the General. I believe we have all been together before, and that we have all loved and served him before. We will not fail! But will the rest of humanity choose light or darkness? We can only offer the gift, not force anyone to receive it. But I do believe we are all Wesley Clark´s spiritual army, come together again in these times when the world is right at the crossroads.
"The will to do, the soul to dare". Wesley Clark.
by KayCeSF
Yes! That's exactly it. It is something quite different. Will you believe me when I say that it is not only his experience, his biography that scares this administration. It IS his energy. They fear him. He knows it ... he knows they pick up on his energy. I cannot imagine having that kind of power, for it truly is, I'll say it again, a double edged sword! He reeks of authenticity.
by KayCeSF
To all of you that worked so hard for Wesley Clark, you know exactly how I feel about him and we will share the triumph of knowing that we worked for the very best of them all, and we will look back feeling exceedingly proud of our part in his campaign. Here's to Clark Recruits all across America. We are so lucky to have shared in this experience. It was an honor!
To all of you that worked so hard for Wesley Clark, you know exactly how I feel about him and we will share the triumph of knowing that we worked for the very best of them all, and we will look back feeling exceedingly proud of our part in his campaign. Here's to Clark Recruits all across America. We are so lucky to have shared in this experience. It was an honor!
by Vicky
We're all feeling the "regrets," Schmeising. (#134) Yet the General's gone on. He's still showing us how a leader leads, even in what feels like us as defeat. But for him, it was never about him. It was always about defeating Bush and actualizing a particular vision for the country. And circumstances aren't going to stop him from doing all that he can do.
We're all feeling the "regrets," Schmeising. (#134) Yet the General's gone on. He's still showing us how a leader leads, even in what feels like us as defeat. But for him, it was never about him. It was always about defeating Bush and actualizing a particular vision for the country. And circumstances aren't going to stop him from doing all that he can do.
(#17) (Rated 5.00/4)
by KayCeSF on 02/25/2004 08:09:03 PM EST
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Thank you Robbed for posting the Georgia Peach's message! I guess we all fear that we are traitors if we step out and work/vote for Kerry. It is hard! I'm really having a very hard time with all the campaigners here in SFe. No one wants to start campaigning for Kerry. I guess I need to give them some time. I am trying to set up a meeting on Monday to talk with everyone, so we can take the grand leap to a Kerry Meetup the following Thursday.
Also ... did you watch Hardball with McCain tonight? He and Chris have decided that it will be very hard for Kerry to not consider Edwards for the VP, ... and interestingly, they said that he may be afraid to go further than Super Tuesday with his campaign, because if he doesn't show well in the remaining Southern states, then it would be hard for him to prove himself worthy of the VP, so he may step out after STuesday. I am just tired of hearing everyone talk about Edwards as though he IS worthy of the VP! Has everyone (media) forgotten that he's only won one state?
by KayCeSF on 02/25/2004 08:09:03 PM EST
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Thank you Robbed for posting the Georgia Peach's message! I guess we all fear that we are traitors if we step out and work/vote for Kerry. It is hard! I'm really having a very hard time with all the campaigners here in SFe. No one wants to start campaigning for Kerry. I guess I need to give them some time. I am trying to set up a meeting on Monday to talk with everyone, so we can take the grand leap to a Kerry Meetup the following Thursday.
Also ... did you watch Hardball with McCain tonight? He and Chris have decided that it will be very hard for Kerry to not consider Edwards for the VP, ... and interestingly, they said that he may be afraid to go further than Super Tuesday with his campaign, because if he doesn't show well in the remaining Southern states, then it would be hard for him to prove himself worthy of the VP, so he may step out after STuesday. I am just tired of hearing everyone talk about Edwards as though he IS worthy of the VP! Has everyone (media) forgotten that he's only won one state?
(#112) (Rated 5.00/1)
by KayCeSF on 02/25/2004 09:24:23 PM EST
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-Tto both of you, there is something amazing about him that I cannot explain, but was felt by others besides myself. He has an energy when you are around him. Now don't laugh, but I truly believe he is a messenger of some kind. There are those, in our lives, and in the past, that are here for special reasons. He is a superior person. But anyway, yes, I talked with him three times. I have my photo with him. WE are both laughing, his eyes are closed (darn it) and I have a fever blister on my bottom lip (darn it), but I will always treasure that photo! But what I want to tell you, is that everywhere he went in NH and here in NM, people couldn't wait to at least be near him. His body guard (you've seen him in many photos), had to literally stand between him and the people coming up, and he would shake hands from the sides of this guy. He always looked EVERYONE in the eye, and he always said something to them quickly, to acknowledge them. When I had my photo with him, he didn't just stand with me. He pulled me close to him with his arm around me, and I have to tell you, I can't remember anything after that moment up to the time I walked away from him and sat down at the restaurant. It was like I was in a silly fog. I've had the opportunity, living in Santa Fe, to be around many VIPs and celebrities. I have never felt like I did those three times with him. Viva Clark!
by KayCeSF on 02/25/2004 09:24:23 PM EST
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-Tto both of you, there is something amazing about him that I cannot explain, but was felt by others besides myself. He has an energy when you are around him. Now don't laugh, but I truly believe he is a messenger of some kind. There are those, in our lives, and in the past, that are here for special reasons. He is a superior person. But anyway, yes, I talked with him three times. I have my photo with him. WE are both laughing, his eyes are closed (darn it) and I have a fever blister on my bottom lip (darn it), but I will always treasure that photo! But what I want to tell you, is that everywhere he went in NH and here in NM, people couldn't wait to at least be near him. His body guard (you've seen him in many photos), had to literally stand between him and the people coming up, and he would shake hands from the sides of this guy. He always looked EVERYONE in the eye, and he always said something to them quickly, to acknowledge them. When I had my photo with him, he didn't just stand with me. He pulled me close to him with his arm around me, and I have to tell you, I can't remember anything after that moment up to the time I walked away from him and sat down at the restaurant. It was like I was in a silly fog. I've had the opportunity, living in Santa Fe, to be around many VIPs and celebrities. I have never felt like I did those three times with him. Viva Clark!
by ksenija (kscatlvr2001@yahoo.com)
If there's anything I've consistently heard about Kerry, it's that thing about little kids. I don't see that about him, either, but I think I'd like to.
The only time I've seen him interact with kids was way back in December when CSPAN followed Kerry around at one of those house parties in New Hampshire. A couple of elementary students cornered him and asked him questions about different things important to them. One of them asked him about the Harry Potter books, and he declined to say anything about them. I mean, not even admitting if he'd read them or not. I realized at that point what a total politician he is.
Actually, ever since I saw that, I'd wondered what Gen. Clark's answer would be to the same question, and then I finally caught that VH1 special where they followed the candidates around and asked them pop culture questions. One of the questions was naming the author of the HP books. Gen. Clark said he didn't know, but he'd read the books. SCORE!
So I think I'd like to see John Kerry with more kids. They ask the best questions!
If there's anything I've consistently heard about Kerry, it's that thing about little kids. I don't see that about him, either, but I think I'd like to.
The only time I've seen him interact with kids was way back in December when CSPAN followed Kerry around at one of those house parties in New Hampshire. A couple of elementary students cornered him and asked him questions about different things important to them. One of them asked him about the Harry Potter books, and he declined to say anything about them. I mean, not even admitting if he'd read them or not. I realized at that point what a total politician he is.
Actually, ever since I saw that, I'd wondered what Gen. Clark's answer would be to the same question, and then I finally caught that VH1 special where they followed the candidates around and asked them pop culture questions. One of the questions was naming the author of the HP books. Gen. Clark said he didn't know, but he'd read the books. SCORE!
So I think I'd like to see John Kerry with more kids. They ask the best questions!
(#149) (Rated 5.00/1)
by TOTALLY COMMITTED on 02/25/2004 10:20:52 AM EST
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originallinda and Lara: I think in this context, "ruggedly handsome" means, "if you squint your eyes, and tilt your head, while he's atanding next to The Elephant man for comparison..."
Kerry wasn't even "ruggedly handsome" when he was young.
Now... to me, our General is "handsome" in a way that none of the others (even Edwards) are -- He's strong and good-looking, certainly, on the outside, but that, coupled with the fact that he's also beautiful and intelligent on the inside... and, that HAS to make him #1 in my book, but I admit it -- I could be biased.
by TOTALLY COMMITTED on 02/25/2004 10:20:52 AM EST
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originallinda and Lara: I think in this context, "ruggedly handsome" means, "if you squint your eyes, and tilt your head, while he's atanding next to The Elephant man for comparison..."
Kerry wasn't even "ruggedly handsome" when he was young.
Now... to me, our General is "handsome" in a way that none of the others (even Edwards) are -- He's strong and good-looking, certainly, on the outside, but that, coupled with the fact that he's also beautiful and intelligent on the inside... and, that HAS to make him #1 in my book, but I admit it -- I could be biased.
Tuesday, February 24, 2004
Conference call - deanies & Edwards people
From: "Randy Risener"
Date: Tue Feb 24, 2004 11:00:06 PM America/Montreal
To: "Clarkactionteam"
Subject: [clarkactionteam] RE: Dean/Edwards Conference Call Tonight
Well, I listened in on the call. Nothing earth shattering. The Deaniacs
have been having much the same kinds of conversations we have regarding
where to go. Edwards is desperate to get their support on Super Tuesday.
Hard to tell how Dean supporters break just from this small sampling (they
are not unanimous) but Edwards might get the majority who don't vote for
Dean.
Most interesting thing was the reason for Dean supporters signing on with
Edwards over Kerry. In their view, Edwards represents the "new" party while
Kerry represents the "old" party.
Edwards' spin was basically that he is the candidate of youth, vigor and the
future as opposed to Kerry whom they consider the candidate of the past;
Edwards, outsider and Kerry, insider.
Randy
From: "Randy Risener"
Date: Tue Feb 24, 2004 11:00:06 PM America/Montreal
To: "Clarkactionteam"
Subject: [clarkactionteam] RE: Dean/Edwards Conference Call Tonight
Well, I listened in on the call. Nothing earth shattering. The Deaniacs
have been having much the same kinds of conversations we have regarding
where to go. Edwards is desperate to get their support on Super Tuesday.
Hard to tell how Dean supporters break just from this small sampling (they
are not unanimous) but Edwards might get the majority who don't vote for
Dean.
Most interesting thing was the reason for Dean supporters signing on with
Edwards over Kerry. In their view, Edwards represents the "new" party while
Kerry represents the "old" party.
Edwards' spin was basically that he is the candidate of youth, vigor and the
future as opposed to Kerry whom they consider the candidate of the past;
Edwards, outsider and Kerry, insider.
Randy
[new] (#217) (No rating)
by Clearsky on 02/24/2004 06:47:57 PM EST
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I'm going to watching his reactions and responses. And absorbing his words and inflexions, not hers.
That doesn't mean I won't take in hers, but I don't want to miss a flicker of his pupils or even slight motion of those "talking hands" of his by being too concerned with Paula.
I still have too many wondrous memories of how sometimes he's had on, as he calls it, "my general's face" and then, sometimes, as one I recall, early-early when he was on cnn with Aaron Brown, Aaron kept trying to get past that "general's face" and, finally, Aaron said something to the effect of "I'm sorry General, I was just pushing on you".
Well. And I do mean WELL. Our General's spine straigtened up a bit and he, ever so slightly, went on guard, shoulders slightly leaning in, ever so slightly. Then, Aaron said something to the effect of having been in Vietnam too, but that he was just a grunt, or something like that, and he'd learned why the generals had all of that egg salad on their hats, it was because they were usually right.
Our General didn't relax at all, not a muscle tensed or untensed or moved a fraction of an inch, but a flicker went through the pupils of those non-blinking eyes, ever, ever so slightly.
The interview went on and not much changed. General Clark spoke as that same General, with his general's face on and that body language. But it was the opening to him for that rare bond that developed between them over time.
I mentioned it to a friend then. That Aaron had indeed done what noone elese had done. Gotten through General Clark's fending them off. And a week or so later, we began to see that, indeed, the armor was down some.
It wasn't long after that that General Clark began to relax a bit more with Wolf and others. Not a whole lot, but a lot more than before that time with Aaron. He was becoming more sure that he had some friends there. Didn't need as much armor on his own.
But, more and more with Aaron, he had the measure of Aaron and it was okay with him, so that by time of those long wonderful evenings and those final wonderful, weekends with Aaron and General Clark, just before General Clark left, General Wes was really laughing a lot with Aaron and, as he is when spontaneous, just incredible in his comments. He and Aaron and were having a grand time of it. Still professional, both of them, but relaxed and enjoying it.And we were watching, watching, with wonder at it all.
I don't expect that tonight. But, Paula's the least of my concerns. And he doesn't need our protection. He's a grown man and an experienced leader. He can take care of himself. He just wants his audience to hear what he has to say and to believe he's saying it because he means it. And that we'll give it regard and consider it as it is, for the substance, not just as if it's the politically best way to say it.
Clearsky
by Clearsky on 02/24/2004 06:47:57 PM EST
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I'm going to watching his reactions and responses. And absorbing his words and inflexions, not hers.
That doesn't mean I won't take in hers, but I don't want to miss a flicker of his pupils or even slight motion of those "talking hands" of his by being too concerned with Paula.
I still have too many wondrous memories of how sometimes he's had on, as he calls it, "my general's face" and then, sometimes, as one I recall, early-early when he was on cnn with Aaron Brown, Aaron kept trying to get past that "general's face" and, finally, Aaron said something to the effect of "I'm sorry General, I was just pushing on you".
Well. And I do mean WELL. Our General's spine straigtened up a bit and he, ever so slightly, went on guard, shoulders slightly leaning in, ever so slightly. Then, Aaron said something to the effect of having been in Vietnam too, but that he was just a grunt, or something like that, and he'd learned why the generals had all of that egg salad on their hats, it was because they were usually right.
Our General didn't relax at all, not a muscle tensed or untensed or moved a fraction of an inch, but a flicker went through the pupils of those non-blinking eyes, ever, ever so slightly.
The interview went on and not much changed. General Clark spoke as that same General, with his general's face on and that body language. But it was the opening to him for that rare bond that developed between them over time.
I mentioned it to a friend then. That Aaron had indeed done what noone elese had done. Gotten through General Clark's fending them off. And a week or so later, we began to see that, indeed, the armor was down some.
It wasn't long after that that General Clark began to relax a bit more with Wolf and others. Not a whole lot, but a lot more than before that time with Aaron. He was becoming more sure that he had some friends there. Didn't need as much armor on his own.
But, more and more with Aaron, he had the measure of Aaron and it was okay with him, so that by time of those long wonderful evenings and those final wonderful, weekends with Aaron and General Clark, just before General Clark left, General Wes was really laughing a lot with Aaron and, as he is when spontaneous, just incredible in his comments. He and Aaron and were having a grand time of it. Still professional, both of them, but relaxed and enjoying it.And we were watching, watching, with wonder at it all.
I don't expect that tonight. But, Paula's the least of my concerns. And he doesn't need our protection. He's a grown man and an experienced leader. He can take care of himself. He just wants his audience to hear what he has to say and to believe he's saying it because he means it. And that we'll give it regard and consider it as it is, for the substance, not just as if it's the politically best way to say it.
Clearsky
I didn't get online until about 1am CST tonight. I
had a chance to teach some high school students some
paleontology and even got to use the 'E' word several
times. I am awaiting the young earth lynch mob. What
the heck, PrezShrub thinks the jury is still out on
evolution and that the Earth is probably less than
10,000 years old. I always knew he was bright enough
to not let facts get in the way of opinion (and
politics).
I'm just glad we were able to bring the Kansas
School Board back from the cluthes of the Wicked Witch
of creationism.
Seriously, I couldn't wear my Clark Button in class,
but I had it on my windbreaker as I walked in and
draped it casually for display during my 2 hour
tenure.
Several students asked me about it at the class
break and I simply told them to look up Clark at
Clark04 on the web.
Organization when subtle can be most delicious!
I really get more questions and encounter more open
minds, now that Clark has dropped from the race.
Every one thinks he should be VP. Ironically, I agree
completely!!
Thanks for the kind comments on the site while I
was away warping young minds. They made my evening
(and cajoled me into another $25 donation). Does
anyone have any idea how much has been contributed so
far. I loved that train that went up to $700,000 for
the week before the Super Seven primaries.
I signed up for the Kerry Meet Up this Thursday and
was sent a message that they only had 4 respondees. I
know one of the others is a co-Clark organizer. Are
we going to have to do everything for them?
I will try to get my personal local organizing tips
together in an action file for Alexandra within a
couple days. My best advice is still WEAR YOUR
BUTTON!!!, smile and listen as they ask you about the
General.
It soothes my savage breast!
Take care and I will try to get online at a decent
time later today.
Craig (paleoman) Sundell
Lawrence, KS
had a chance to teach some high school students some
paleontology and even got to use the 'E' word several
times. I am awaiting the young earth lynch mob. What
the heck, PrezShrub thinks the jury is still out on
evolution and that the Earth is probably less than
10,000 years old. I always knew he was bright enough
to not let facts get in the way of opinion (and
politics).
I'm just glad we were able to bring the Kansas
School Board back from the cluthes of the Wicked Witch
of creationism.
Seriously, I couldn't wear my Clark Button in class,
but I had it on my windbreaker as I walked in and
draped it casually for display during my 2 hour
tenure.
Several students asked me about it at the class
break and I simply told them to look up Clark at
Clark04 on the web.
Organization when subtle can be most delicious!
I really get more questions and encounter more open
minds, now that Clark has dropped from the race.
Every one thinks he should be VP. Ironically, I agree
completely!!
Thanks for the kind comments on the site while I
was away warping young minds. They made my evening
(and cajoled me into another $25 donation). Does
anyone have any idea how much has been contributed so
far. I loved that train that went up to $700,000 for
the week before the Super Seven primaries.
I signed up for the Kerry Meet Up this Thursday and
was sent a message that they only had 4 respondees. I
know one of the others is a co-Clark organizer. Are
we going to have to do everything for them?
I will try to get my personal local organizing tips
together in an action file for Alexandra within a
couple days. My best advice is still WEAR YOUR
BUTTON!!!, smile and listen as they ask you about the
General.
It soothes my savage breast!
Take care and I will try to get online at a decent
time later today.
Craig (paleoman) Sundell
Lawrence, KS
Monday, February 23, 2004
Being a "Wes Clark Democrat" means is that I'm not a DNC Democrat,
because I am not any longer. I left the Party after the 2000
Election, and only came back to vote for Wes. I will remain a "Wes
Clark Democrat" because he says that the Democratic Party is the
Party he supports, but will keep his name IN FRONT of the Party so
they will be reminded that were it not for WES CLARK, I WOULD NOT BE
IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. I will proudly wear that title to further
remind them that even though they were so ungrateful and treated him
with such contempt, he endorsed their candidate and asked his
supporters to do the same. I say that even if you are not a Democrat,
you can still be a "Wes Clark Democrat" because THAT is the furthest
thing from being a DNC Democrat that you can be!
Just a thought, and an opinion.
because I am not any longer. I left the Party after the 2000
Election, and only came back to vote for Wes. I will remain a "Wes
Clark Democrat" because he says that the Democratic Party is the
Party he supports, but will keep his name IN FRONT of the Party so
they will be reminded that were it not for WES CLARK, I WOULD NOT BE
IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. I will proudly wear that title to further
remind them that even though they were so ungrateful and treated him
with such contempt, he endorsed their candidate and asked his
supporters to do the same. I say that even if you are not a Democrat,
you can still be a "Wes Clark Democrat" because THAT is the furthest
thing from being a DNC Democrat that you can be!
Just a thought, and an opinion.
Push poll
I, and several other Clarkies that I have spoken to here in Richmond, VA were telephoned and polled.
I don't remember the polling agency's name, just that it had 'tax' in the title.
Most of the questions were distastful to me, but a few stand out...
Q: Does it bother you that your taxes are going to go up by 500 Million dollars?
A: No.
Q: Do you consider yourself Pro-Life?
A: No (I'm pro-death, ... jeez)
As far as I could tell, it was a robo-call of some kind... I don't think there was
a human on the other side of the phone. I could be wrong, I didn't try to argue with him.
Caller id did give me a phone number though.
Cc Advertising Biz
Herndon, VA 20151
703-488-9800
According to an entry in this blog: http://jimvb.home.mindspring.com/blogger.html
This company has been used by Virginia Delegate Kirk Cox,
and Senator Steve Martin in recent weeks.
What an obnoxius way to spread talking points below the press radar...
I, and several other Clarkies that I have spoken to here in Richmond, VA were telephoned and polled.
I don't remember the polling agency's name, just that it had 'tax' in the title.
Most of the questions were distastful to me, but a few stand out...
Q: Does it bother you that your taxes are going to go up by 500 Million dollars?
A: No.
Q: Do you consider yourself Pro-Life?
A: No (I'm pro-death, ... jeez)
As far as I could tell, it was a robo-call of some kind... I don't think there was
a human on the other side of the phone. I could be wrong, I didn't try to argue with him.
Caller id did give me a phone number though.
Cc Advertising Biz
Herndon, VA 20151
703-488-9800
According to an entry in this blog: http://jimvb.home.mindspring.com/blogger.html
This company has been used by Virginia Delegate Kirk Cox,
and Senator Steve Martin in recent weeks.
What an obnoxius way to spread talking points below the press radar...
Sunday, February 22, 2004
I went back to the basic blog after dinner and, no luck. Like others
note, it appears the blog is down. I certainly hope it is temporary!
After watching the video of the General's withdrawal speech
accompanied by lyrics from the song "We'll Follow the Old Man..."
from the movie White Christmas (wonderfully provided by Ice), I had
to go back and watch the movie. My husband comes in and I'm bawling.
I hadn't realized just how patriotic the movie was. Previously I had
focused on the romance rather than on the General. Funny how learning
about and coming to admire General Clark has changed my perception of
generals! So I started crying in the beginning when Bing Crosby and
Danny Kaye and the soldiers are singing about their beloved General
who was, in their opinion, unfairly replaced (sound familiar?). Then
later when Bing Crosby and Danny Kaye sing, "What do you do with a
general when he stops being a general?" I started bawling all over
again. I'd never really thought about it. Now most retired generals
make money off the government (the taxpayers!) by selling their
connections to the military-industrial complex for big bucks. But our
general just wants to keep serving his country! How can we now love
the man?!
Okay, I just had to express my emotions!! Continue on.....
Vicky
note, it appears the blog is down. I certainly hope it is temporary!
After watching the video of the General's withdrawal speech
accompanied by lyrics from the song "We'll Follow the Old Man..."
from the movie White Christmas (wonderfully provided by Ice), I had
to go back and watch the movie. My husband comes in and I'm bawling.
I hadn't realized just how patriotic the movie was. Previously I had
focused on the romance rather than on the General. Funny how learning
about and coming to admire General Clark has changed my perception of
generals! So I started crying in the beginning when Bing Crosby and
Danny Kaye and the soldiers are singing about their beloved General
who was, in their opinion, unfairly replaced (sound familiar?). Then
later when Bing Crosby and Danny Kaye sing, "What do you do with a
general when he stops being a general?" I started bawling all over
again. I'd never really thought about it. Now most retired generals
make money off the government (the taxpayers!) by selling their
connections to the military-industrial complex for big bucks. But our
general just wants to keep serving his country! How can we now love
the man?!
Okay, I just had to express my emotions!! Continue on.....
Vicky
NEWS FROM CLARK
Saturday, February 21, 2004
Hello, everyone.
General Clark has been in the Los Angeles area for a
few days staying at a seaside house in Malibu,
relaxing, spending time with his family, and getting
ready for the next steps. On Friday my wife and I
spent a little over an hour with him and Gert in
Malibu candidly discussing a wide range of topics,
including the campaign, modern journalism, economics,
world history, and the road ahead. I'm not sure
whether any other grassroots leaders have had a chance
to meet with him since he stopped actively
campaigning, so I want to share with everyone some of
the pertinent parts of our conversation.
The General and Gert were both remarkably genuine and
honest with their analysis of the campaign. And,
though they were clearly disappointed, they didn't
seem sad or down at all, rather they seemed resolute
and a little tired. Their assessments are really not
that different than what we've all concluded on the
newsgroups and blogs. Basically, they felt they had
terriffic and widespread support nationwide, but had
remarkable difficulty getting their message
articulated in the mass media. Also, the General
himself took blame for starting late and not knowing
exactly what kind of team would be required for a
compressed-schedule primary season. In other words,
he lived up to his own principles and was holding
himself accountable.
It's also very clear that his primary motivation for
entering the race was to defeat George Bush. He's not
interested in glory, a big house, or any of the
trappings of being President. He genuinely feels that
he gives us the best chance to beat George Bush, and
he considers that another 4 years of Bush would be
grave.
I came away from our meeting convinced more than ever
that he would be a fantastic President. His knowledge
of manufacturing processes, U.S. economic history, the
military, and every other topic we discussed was
extensive. His tone, demeanor and positive
attitude--despite the setback in his campaign--were
inspiring. In all, this man might have been the best
candidate we've seen in a LONG time (since Lincoln?).
And Gert? Well, she's just awesome. I don't know how
else to say it. I keep imagining her as First Lady.
Wes Clark has many policy nuances and details in his
head, but the two themes that he repeated several
times yesterday were that we really need to get back
to 1) an effective multilateralist foreign policy, and
2) sound domestic fiscal policies. Why are these the
two most important near-term agenda items in his
opinion? Because their ill-effects can devastate a
country in just a few years. Once we get these two
sectors in order, then we can deal with health care,
education, the environment and so forth.
I told the General a little bit about the
conversations on the blogs and newsgroups and the
overwhelming desire by our various regional groups to
stay intact in some form or another. I think he was
encouraged that his supporters aren't going anywhere,
and I'm sure he would be pleased to see us carry on
and remain a national force.
I asked if there is anything we can do to help him
out, and he said plainly that he would love it if
everyone can give $10 towards the $150,000 remaining
campaign debt, which otherwise will come from his own
pockets.
I asked him about his future, and he genuinely doesn't
know what's next. He remains committed to getting
George W. Bush defeated in November, and so he plans
on doing whatever he can to help that cause. As to
whether he expects to be V.P. or a cabinet member, he
said he doesn't know, and that it depends on too many
other factors to guess right now where he can
contribute best to the cause. In other words, my take
away message is that this man remains dedicated to the
country, and he will do whatever is necessary to make
the country stronger and economically sound.
He is an amazing man. It's hard to believe that
someone this honest tried to run for President, and
it's frustrating to see that the American political
process doesn't reward such honesty.
After yesterday's intimate discussions, I feel more
determined than ever to carry his legacy forward.
Here's what I think we *ALL* need to do:
1) form a single national group umbrella organization
dedicated to furthering his principles (effective
multilateralist foreign policy, fiscally-sound
domestic economic policies, reformed health care,
investments in education, protecting the environment,
accountable/transparent leadership, and so forth)
2) all of us grassrooters would then form local
chapters of this single national organization
3) activities could include monthly community service,
Voter registration/GOTV, and
networking/spread-the-word events (house parties?),
and so forth
4) local chapters could also form democratic clubs for
endorsing candidates and electing like-minded people
into office
I think we have an obligation to build this
organization, which could then be an intellectual
platform for Wes Clark. He's responded to our call to
duty before, so I feel VERY CONFIDENT that if we build
this organization and ask him to lead it, then he
will. At the least, I'm sure he would be willing to
join us for a monthly conference call. We can become
the mouthpiece through which his ideas are heard and
the vehicle by which his principles take hold.
We need to figure out our specific form (a 501c(3),
527, or PAC?) and our name ASAP, and then get this
thing rolling officially sometime in the next few
weeks.
I know that my participation has generally been silent
on these newsgroups, so many of you have no idea who I
am, but I assure you that a single national
organization with local chapters is simply our best
route to success.
And, because L.A. has such a stronghold of Clark
support (5500+ local grassroots Clark supporters built
from the ground up!), we would be happy to volunteer
ourselves take on the tedious
organizational/administrative burden for this
organization. And, I think we can count on the
support of Wes Clark, Jr., who lives in Los Angeles,
as the organization's first Chairman--he's basically
admitted as much to me.
Here are our tasks:
Action Item #1: Figure out our name (Wes Clark
Society, 4 Star Alliance, Wes Clark Democrats,
Principled Leadership Coalition, etc.)
Action Item #2: Write our mission statement
Action Item #3: Figure out our legal form (PAC, 527,
501c(3),...)
Action Item #4: have a kick-off event and conference
call with the General in the second half of March!
We need to act NOW, before we lose our energy and
organizational structures.
After having spent so much time with Wes Clark
yesterday, I feel that we owe him an organization like
this. He answered our request to become a candidate,
and so now we owe him the favor of keeping his
national impact permanent.
Should we have another conference call on this topic
this week? NOT a conference call where we complain
about what went wrong with the campaign, but instead a
call where we focus purely on the road ahead.
With great enthusiasm for the future,
Michael Webber
Michael E. Webber, Ph.D.
Greater LA Area Grassroots Organizer, Clark 2004
Wesley Clark for President! All Patriot, No Act.
10855 Barman Ave.
Culver City, CA 90230
ClarkForPresident@rarejules.com
Saturday, February 21, 2004
Hello, everyone.
General Clark has been in the Los Angeles area for a
few days staying at a seaside house in Malibu,
relaxing, spending time with his family, and getting
ready for the next steps. On Friday my wife and I
spent a little over an hour with him and Gert in
Malibu candidly discussing a wide range of topics,
including the campaign, modern journalism, economics,
world history, and the road ahead. I'm not sure
whether any other grassroots leaders have had a chance
to meet with him since he stopped actively
campaigning, so I want to share with everyone some of
the pertinent parts of our conversation.
The General and Gert were both remarkably genuine and
honest with their analysis of the campaign. And,
though they were clearly disappointed, they didn't
seem sad or down at all, rather they seemed resolute
and a little tired. Their assessments are really not
that different than what we've all concluded on the
newsgroups and blogs. Basically, they felt they had
terriffic and widespread support nationwide, but had
remarkable difficulty getting their message
articulated in the mass media. Also, the General
himself took blame for starting late and not knowing
exactly what kind of team would be required for a
compressed-schedule primary season. In other words,
he lived up to his own principles and was holding
himself accountable.
It's also very clear that his primary motivation for
entering the race was to defeat George Bush. He's not
interested in glory, a big house, or any of the
trappings of being President. He genuinely feels that
he gives us the best chance to beat George Bush, and
he considers that another 4 years of Bush would be
grave.
I came away from our meeting convinced more than ever
that he would be a fantastic President. His knowledge
of manufacturing processes, U.S. economic history, the
military, and every other topic we discussed was
extensive. His tone, demeanor and positive
attitude--despite the setback in his campaign--were
inspiring. In all, this man might have been the best
candidate we've seen in a LONG time (since Lincoln?).
And Gert? Well, she's just awesome. I don't know how
else to say it. I keep imagining her as First Lady.
Wes Clark has many policy nuances and details in his
head, but the two themes that he repeated several
times yesterday were that we really need to get back
to 1) an effective multilateralist foreign policy, and
2) sound domestic fiscal policies. Why are these the
two most important near-term agenda items in his
opinion? Because their ill-effects can devastate a
country in just a few years. Once we get these two
sectors in order, then we can deal with health care,
education, the environment and so forth.
I told the General a little bit about the
conversations on the blogs and newsgroups and the
overwhelming desire by our various regional groups to
stay intact in some form or another. I think he was
encouraged that his supporters aren't going anywhere,
and I'm sure he would be pleased to see us carry on
and remain a national force.
I asked if there is anything we can do to help him
out, and he said plainly that he would love it if
everyone can give $10 towards the $150,000 remaining
campaign debt, which otherwise will come from his own
pockets.
I asked him about his future, and he genuinely doesn't
know what's next. He remains committed to getting
George W. Bush defeated in November, and so he plans
on doing whatever he can to help that cause. As to
whether he expects to be V.P. or a cabinet member, he
said he doesn't know, and that it depends on too many
other factors to guess right now where he can
contribute best to the cause. In other words, my take
away message is that this man remains dedicated to the
country, and he will do whatever is necessary to make
the country stronger and economically sound.
He is an amazing man. It's hard to believe that
someone this honest tried to run for President, and
it's frustrating to see that the American political
process doesn't reward such honesty.
After yesterday's intimate discussions, I feel more
determined than ever to carry his legacy forward.
Here's what I think we *ALL* need to do:
1) form a single national group umbrella organization
dedicated to furthering his principles (effective
multilateralist foreign policy, fiscally-sound
domestic economic policies, reformed health care,
investments in education, protecting the environment,
accountable/transparent leadership, and so forth)
2) all of us grassrooters would then form local
chapters of this single national organization
3) activities could include monthly community service,
Voter registration/GOTV, and
networking/spread-the-word events (house parties?),
and so forth
4) local chapters could also form democratic clubs for
endorsing candidates and electing like-minded people
into office
I think we have an obligation to build this
organization, which could then be an intellectual
platform for Wes Clark. He's responded to our call to
duty before, so I feel VERY CONFIDENT that if we build
this organization and ask him to lead it, then he
will. At the least, I'm sure he would be willing to
join us for a monthly conference call. We can become
the mouthpiece through which his ideas are heard and
the vehicle by which his principles take hold.
We need to figure out our specific form (a 501c(3),
527, or PAC?) and our name ASAP, and then get this
thing rolling officially sometime in the next few
weeks.
I know that my participation has generally been silent
on these newsgroups, so many of you have no idea who I
am, but I assure you that a single national
organization with local chapters is simply our best
route to success.
And, because L.A. has such a stronghold of Clark
support (5500+ local grassroots Clark supporters built
from the ground up!), we would be happy to volunteer
ourselves take on the tedious
organizational/administrative burden for this
organization. And, I think we can count on the
support of Wes Clark, Jr., who lives in Los Angeles,
as the organization's first Chairman--he's basically
admitted as much to me.
Here are our tasks:
Action Item #1: Figure out our name (Wes Clark
Society, 4 Star Alliance, Wes Clark Democrats,
Principled Leadership Coalition, etc.)
Action Item #2: Write our mission statement
Action Item #3: Figure out our legal form (PAC, 527,
501c(3),...)
Action Item #4: have a kick-off event and conference
call with the General in the second half of March!
We need to act NOW, before we lose our energy and
organizational structures.
After having spent so much time with Wes Clark
yesterday, I feel that we owe him an organization like
this. He answered our request to become a candidate,
and so now we owe him the favor of keeping his
national impact permanent.
Should we have another conference call on this topic
this week? NOT a conference call where we complain
about what went wrong with the campaign, but instead a
call where we focus purely on the road ahead.
With great enthusiasm for the future,
Michael Webber
Michael E. Webber, Ph.D.
Greater LA Area Grassroots Organizer, Clark 2004
Wesley Clark for President! All Patriot, No Act.
10855 Barman Ave.
Culver City, CA 90230
ClarkForPresident@rarejules.com
Saturday, February 21, 2004
by ElizabethEnglish on 02/21/2004 09:02:58 AM EST
Alexm,
General Clark made it clear in his one and only official communication, through e-mail and then this site, that this in fact is the site from which he intends to carry on his message.
Lots of new people are posting who may not have felt comfortable doing so before....I don't know the whys and the wherefores, but transition is always hard, in any walk or happening in life, transition is the time that tests and strenghtens.
We have been left alone, for the time being, to "Tawk amongst owaselves"
Topic...get rid of Bush.
Meet and greet newcomers, get tougher, leaner and more focused. Go back to the original purpose that brought us here, our mutual understnding that General Clark has what it takes to get Bush gone.
What form that process takes, will have to involve people like us. I admire everyone for being here, new and old users, it matters not, shy and bold, it takes all kinds.
Have a good day all. I have to rake leaves today, that have now stuck to the ground because they should have been attended to last fall, victims to the job of raking Bush out of our White House instead.
And to our little mascot Ramzey, soldier on little guy, you are our future.
Elizabeth in Greensboro
Alexm,
General Clark made it clear in his one and only official communication, through e-mail and then this site, that this in fact is the site from which he intends to carry on his message.
Lots of new people are posting who may not have felt comfortable doing so before....I don't know the whys and the wherefores, but transition is always hard, in any walk or happening in life, transition is the time that tests and strenghtens.
We have been left alone, for the time being, to "Tawk amongst owaselves"
Topic...get rid of Bush.
Meet and greet newcomers, get tougher, leaner and more focused. Go back to the original purpose that brought us here, our mutual understnding that General Clark has what it takes to get Bush gone.
What form that process takes, will have to involve people like us. I admire everyone for being here, new and old users, it matters not, shy and bold, it takes all kinds.
Have a good day all. I have to rake leaves today, that have now stuck to the ground because they should have been attended to last fall, victims to the job of raking Bush out of our White House instead.
And to our little mascot Ramzey, soldier on little guy, you are our future.
Elizabeth in Greensboro
CCN - final count in WI -
Reply-To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
by AllyCat
Heee hee! I never did hear a final count on the votes, but I was
impressed with the last number I heard of 13,000 and 2% of the vote.
The best part was when the pundits talked about the race the next day
on WPR, they said that Sharpton had 1% and it occured to me that Wes
had finished AHEAD of Sharpton without even being in the race.
Certainly, absentee ballots did not account for that much of the final
numbers. I know quite a few people who voted for him on Tuesday. It
felt great to do it, didn't it?
Reply-To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
by AllyCat
Heee hee! I never did hear a final count on the votes, but I was
impressed with the last number I heard of 13,000 and 2% of the vote.
The best part was when the pundits talked about the race the next day
on WPR, they said that Sharpton had 1% and it occured to me that Wes
had finished AHEAD of Sharpton without even being in the race.
Certainly, absentee ballots did not account for that much of the final
numbers. I know quite a few people who voted for him on Tuesday. It
felt great to do it, didn't it?
ole olafson
Date: Sat Feb 21, 2004 12:28:39 AM America/Montreal
To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [UnitedForClark] :(
Reply-To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
He won't be alone for long. This man is too valuable to be left alone. My nephew
served in Bosnia, awful experience and he got to shake the general's hand when
he came to visit them. Josh was attached to a UN unit with the Danes. He LOVES
the general and we are together on our desire to have him lead this country. I am
so envious. He says Clark is a good and genuine man.
Anisha Lal wrote:
Just searching through Yahoo Photos - hadn't seen this one. This is hard to take:
http://tinyurl.com/2sxl9
Date: Sat Feb 21, 2004 12:28:39 AM America/Montreal
To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [UnitedForClark] :(
Reply-To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
He won't be alone for long. This man is too valuable to be left alone. My nephew
served in Bosnia, awful experience and he got to shake the general's hand when
he came to visit them. Josh was attached to a UN unit with the Danes. He LOVES
the general and we are together on our desire to have him lead this country. I am
so envious. He says Clark is a good and genuine man.
Anisha Lal
Just searching through Yahoo Photos - hadn't seen this one. This is hard to take:
http://tinyurl.com/2sxl9
Friday, February 20, 2004
Gene Caulfield message
"I know that all the volunteers have a great sense of loyality to the General
but the proposal to publish an ad would be counter productive to everyone's
long range goals. We all wish to continue the spirit of the campaign in order
to accomplish greater goals. We must continue to work together under one banner
in order to have strength. The attempt to tear down another is not what Wes
had in mind when his candidacy was in full operation. The campaign has been
suspended but the delegates are still ours. I hope that we will gain more
delegates since we are on all the states ballots and will have a greater say in the
convention.
Gene"
"I know that all the volunteers have a great sense of loyality to the General
but the proposal to publish an ad would be counter productive to everyone's
long range goals. We all wish to continue the spirit of the campaign in order
to accomplish greater goals. We must continue to work together under one banner
in order to have strength. The attempt to tear down another is not what Wes
had in mind when his candidacy was in full operation. The campaign has been
suspended but the delegates are still ours. I hope that we will gain more
delegates since we are on all the states ballots and will have a greater say in the
convention.
Gene"
Thursday, February 19, 2004
Today's dean spam
Governor Dean also asked me to offer some practical advice and guidance concerning our delegate candidates. It is true that Governor Dean’s name will remain on the ballot and our delegate candidates will be eligible to receive votes on March 2nd. However, it is important to keep in mind that getting elected as a delegate requires Governor Dean meeting two important thresholds: he must win at least 15% of the votes cast statewide in the popular vote contest that is separate from the vote for delegate candidates, AND he must capture 15% of the vote in the delegate’s Congressional District.
In his speech yesterday afternoon and in our conversation, Governor Dean was clear about his commitment not to run as an independent or third party candidate. He asked me to urge all his supporters not to undermine the eventual Democratic nominee by backing a third party candidate, but rather to keep focused on what is most important -- beating George W. Bush in November.
snip
I know that some of our delegates are electable as individuals in their home communities. However, I want to underscore that given the Governor’s withdrawal from the race, the absence of any resources or the Governor’s presence in New York, combined with what is shaping up to be a hot Kerry-Edwards contest with many voters wanting to make a choice between the two of them, it will be enormously difficult for us to win 15% of the vote statewide. For those who want to soldier on to win votes for Governor Dean and his delegates, you have his blessing and appreciation, but he felt it was important to communicate that despite whatever efforts may be made, there is no assurance that we can meet the threshold requirement to earn delegates.
Governor Dean also asked me to offer some practical advice and guidance concerning our delegate candidates. It is true that Governor Dean’s name will remain on the ballot and our delegate candidates will be eligible to receive votes on March 2nd. However, it is important to keep in mind that getting elected as a delegate requires Governor Dean meeting two important thresholds: he must win at least 15% of the votes cast statewide in the popular vote contest that is separate from the vote for delegate candidates, AND he must capture 15% of the vote in the delegate’s Congressional District.
In his speech yesterday afternoon and in our conversation, Governor Dean was clear about his commitment not to run as an independent or third party candidate. He asked me to urge all his supporters not to undermine the eventual Democratic nominee by backing a third party candidate, but rather to keep focused on what is most important -- beating George W. Bush in November.
snip
I know that some of our delegates are electable as individuals in their home communities. However, I want to underscore that given the Governor’s withdrawal from the race, the absence of any resources or the Governor’s presence in New York, combined with what is shaping up to be a hot Kerry-Edwards contest with many voters wanting to make a choice between the two of them, it will be enormously difficult for us to win 15% of the vote statewide. For those who want to soldier on to win votes for Governor Dean and his delegates, you have his blessing and appreciation, but he felt it was important to communicate that despite whatever efforts may be made, there is no assurance that we can meet the threshold requirement to earn delegates.
Waiting for Kerry endorsement by the AFL-CIO, a reporter stating Wes
Clarks letter to his grass-roots supporters, that he encouraged his
constituients to stand behind the nominee...question he asked is why
didn't Clark state Kerry instead of nominee, since he backed him.
Reporter said, they were going to contact Clark Headquarters to get
explanation. Hum-m-m
Clarks letter to his grass-roots supporters, that he encouraged his
constituients to stand behind the nominee...question he asked is why
didn't Clark state Kerry instead of nominee, since he backed him.
Reporter said, they were going to contact Clark Headquarters to get
explanation. Hum-m-m
(#285) (No rating)
by Clearsky on 02/19/2004 02:08:27 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Parent | Reply
Religious issues, especially those having to do with fundamentalist religious issues, are THE major themes in recent and current elections in the United States.
And tickets to this movie are being bought up in blocks and even given away by conservative religious groups and churches. And so, one need not have to think very hard to answer the question re why this movie is a topic of many messages on a blog devoted to political matters in the United States.
Most here appear to be of moderate religious views and practices, as is General Wes Clark and his wife. While some are not, and some are soundly non-religious, the political aspects of current politics has to be considered by anyone wanting to be effective in political action in the U.S.
That's the straightforward, polite answer.
Clearsky
by Clearsky on 02/19/2004 02:08:27 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Parent | Reply
Religious issues, especially those having to do with fundamentalist religious issues, are THE major themes in recent and current elections in the United States.
And tickets to this movie are being bought up in blocks and even given away by conservative religious groups and churches. And so, one need not have to think very hard to answer the question re why this movie is a topic of many messages on a blog devoted to political matters in the United States.
Most here appear to be of moderate religious views and practices, as is General Wes Clark and his wife. While some are not, and some are soundly non-religious, the political aspects of current politics has to be considered by anyone wanting to be effective in political action in the U.S.
That's the straightforward, polite answer.
Clearsky
(#40) (Rated 5.00/5)
by RANIER ARMY (tracer9400@msn.com) on 02/19/2004 12:10:21 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Reply
You are not going to believe it
I just returned from HELL!
I Woke up and filtered a stiff cup of joe and went down to the inner-BFA. You know, the heart of the city where the radical Deaniacs hang out in their eccentric garb uttering desperate words and beating the drums of change.
As I neared downtown on the south-central side of the BFA, I started to hear shouting and I smelled smoke. I turned the corner of Vermont and Wellstone and I saw it. There were hundreds of police standing as a human barricade. There were hundreds of cars flipped over burning. The crowds were throwing beer and wine bottles and brawling with the police. One large fire had 20-30 people chanting and crying and running around naked, they were screaming and swaying and holding hands.
I couldn't breath...the smell of fuel and the smoke watered my eyes. The BFA is torched and is burning to the ground. Tom Harkin is calling for order with a bullhorn. Al Gore has decided to declare an emergency...They laughed at him and his car was rushed by a violent crowd and his car was nearly tipped over. Someone reached in and ripped off the former Vice President's toupee. The Gore caravan barely escaped with the help of emergency military vehicles leading the way through the unruly masses. Bill Bradley was said to be holding a peace and love rally on the corner of Hemp and Maple at noon. Carol Mosely Braun was heard on a loudspeaker asking if she was going to be paid...I'm serious!
I stood on a pile of unburned crates and looked over a large crowd of fired up Deanies. To my amazement I noticed it was Howard himself! The ring-leader, the legend, the great Vermont uniter was screaming to all who would listen that the end was almost near. He shouted profanity and ripped off his shirt and beat his chest and let fly his greatest post-election primal scream you have ever heard! I was scared and concerned as the crowd started to go nuts. Howard rubbed mud all over his chest and poured a bottle of wine all over himself. Dean grabbed a stick that was still on fire and branded his stomach, and yelled with pain. He threw the stick into the crowd and people scrambled and fought to own the new prize. Dean nearly blew out the hastily erected P-A system with his crying. The crowd was swarming and getting too close. I had to run.
I saw media people being pummeled. Their cameras crushed and ripped apart, their vehicles rummaged through and then set afire. I couldn't save any of the poor souls.
I had my cup of joementum knocked out of my hands as I hurried toward a safe place. Someone selling hacky-sacks and black beads yelled at me for wearing my Clark04 shirt and shoved me. He backed off and ran toward a mass gathering at the front of a discovered gop office masked as an environmental agency. Looked like serious trouble was brewing. Someone was dragged out and handed to the crowd. I ran and ran faster...I had to jump piles of burning clothes and dodge through people who looked at me with a despair I haven't seen since thumbing through old National Geographic magazines on the Vietnam war. Their eyes splashed fear and suffering on me. One teen girl ran up to me and screamed bloody murder and cried for help while squeezing my arms. I was scared but I couldn't help to notice all of her tatoos up and down her legs and arms. I told her to sit down and calm down...I asked to look at her feet...I held her for a second but she ripped away and ran down the road leaving noticeable footprints from all the broken glass.
I ran as fast as I could up a grassy hill toward safety. Sirens squelched and ambulances roared past in every direction. I looked back down at the smoky scene, my heart pounding and my eyes were dry and scratched with soot...I could barely make out a set of clean, colorful vans coming from the north-west. I watched them stop and park right behind several ambulances. I noticed a man get out and start screaming about two Americas...one for them and one for everyone else...I had to run faster to escape.
I'm glad to be home...in my safe and sane CCN. Where the crowd only stirs after dark from time to time.
Sorry this was so long, it was terrible, simply the ugliest thing I have ever witnessed. God bless the BFA...it is crumbling to the ground, as if nature had never intended for such a place....
by RANIER ARMY (tracer9400@msn.com) on 02/19/2004 12:10:21 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Reply
You are not going to believe it
I just returned from HELL!
I Woke up and filtered a stiff cup of joe and went down to the inner-BFA. You know, the heart of the city where the radical Deaniacs hang out in their eccentric garb uttering desperate words and beating the drums of change.
As I neared downtown on the south-central side of the BFA, I started to hear shouting and I smelled smoke. I turned the corner of Vermont and Wellstone and I saw it. There were hundreds of police standing as a human barricade. There were hundreds of cars flipped over burning. The crowds were throwing beer and wine bottles and brawling with the police. One large fire had 20-30 people chanting and crying and running around naked, they were screaming and swaying and holding hands.
I couldn't breath...the smell of fuel and the smoke watered my eyes. The BFA is torched and is burning to the ground. Tom Harkin is calling for order with a bullhorn. Al Gore has decided to declare an emergency...They laughed at him and his car was rushed by a violent crowd and his car was nearly tipped over. Someone reached in and ripped off the former Vice President's toupee. The Gore caravan barely escaped with the help of emergency military vehicles leading the way through the unruly masses. Bill Bradley was said to be holding a peace and love rally on the corner of Hemp and Maple at noon. Carol Mosely Braun was heard on a loudspeaker asking if she was going to be paid...I'm serious!
I stood on a pile of unburned crates and looked over a large crowd of fired up Deanies. To my amazement I noticed it was Howard himself! The ring-leader, the legend, the great Vermont uniter was screaming to all who would listen that the end was almost near. He shouted profanity and ripped off his shirt and beat his chest and let fly his greatest post-election primal scream you have ever heard! I was scared and concerned as the crowd started to go nuts. Howard rubbed mud all over his chest and poured a bottle of wine all over himself. Dean grabbed a stick that was still on fire and branded his stomach, and yelled with pain. He threw the stick into the crowd and people scrambled and fought to own the new prize. Dean nearly blew out the hastily erected P-A system with his crying. The crowd was swarming and getting too close. I had to run.
I saw media people being pummeled. Their cameras crushed and ripped apart, their vehicles rummaged through and then set afire. I couldn't save any of the poor souls.
I had my cup of joementum knocked out of my hands as I hurried toward a safe place. Someone selling hacky-sacks and black beads yelled at me for wearing my Clark04 shirt and shoved me. He backed off and ran toward a mass gathering at the front of a discovered gop office masked as an environmental agency. Looked like serious trouble was brewing. Someone was dragged out and handed to the crowd. I ran and ran faster...I had to jump piles of burning clothes and dodge through people who looked at me with a despair I haven't seen since thumbing through old National Geographic magazines on the Vietnam war. Their eyes splashed fear and suffering on me. One teen girl ran up to me and screamed bloody murder and cried for help while squeezing my arms. I was scared but I couldn't help to notice all of her tatoos up and down her legs and arms. I told her to sit down and calm down...I asked to look at her feet...I held her for a second but she ripped away and ran down the road leaving noticeable footprints from all the broken glass.
I ran as fast as I could up a grassy hill toward safety. Sirens squelched and ambulances roared past in every direction. I looked back down at the smoky scene, my heart pounding and my eyes were dry and scratched with soot...I could barely make out a set of clean, colorful vans coming from the north-west. I watched them stop and park right behind several ambulances. I noticed a man get out and start screaming about two Americas...one for them and one for everyone else...I had to run faster to escape.
I'm glad to be home...in my safe and sane CCN. Where the crowd only stirs after dark from time to time.
Sorry this was so long, it was terrible, simply the ugliest thing I have ever witnessed. God bless the BFA...it is crumbling to the ground, as if nature had never intended for such a place....
Edwards reps went first (were there 45 min early) and didn't do much to inspire any of us...they weren't the best people to send. One of the questions raised with them was the Hugh Shelton comments--we knew that would be touchy, but as I told them, it made a huge negative impression on us and we could see no reason for the early smear of Clark that seemed to remain in the news for the duration. They had no comments other than "Shelton did not speak for Edwards". They were looking into whether Shelton was a paid staff member/advisor, or just a peripheral loose cannon.
On Thursday, February 19, 2004, at 05:32 AM, Montgomery County For Clark wrote:
Dear Clark Supporter,
As an original Draft Clark movement member, I'm writing to tell you why Bush and Carl Rove's $ 200 Million Smear Machine will destroy Kerry in November. First off, Kerry has a 19 Year Voting Record in the Senate that is going to be twisted and distorted and smeared against him. For example, Kerry Voted FOR NAFTA and many other controversial issues that now he's against. Secondly the Republicans are already running attack ads across the Nation against Kerry pointing out how he accepted enormous amounts of Special interest money over his 19 year Senate career, much more than almost every Senator that has ever served. If you've been watching the news lately you will have noticed that the " Gay Marriage " issue has exploded and is now a huge SOCIAL ISSUE that Bush will be using to his advantage, especially in the South. For the past 3 weeks Republicans have been on TV saying that Kerry is more liberal than his fellow Senator from Massachusetts Ted Kennedy. Their going to love telling Americans how Kerry is the Senator from Massachusetts where they have already passed laws allowing " Gay Marriage ". Every Democrat President who has won the White House in American history has had to win at the VERY LEAST 5 Southern States. That's 1,2,3,4,5 SOUTHERN STATES. Bill Clinton did it and so did JFK. Al Gore lost every one of them. There are already newspapers all over the South that are saying that Kerry is FOR " GAY MARRIAGE ". That's a quote, they don't say Civil Unions which Kerry is on the record as being for. They're saying " GAY MARRIAGE ". Just try explaining to a Southerner the difference between Civil Unions and Gay Marriage. YOU CAN'T. It's all the same to them. Now that our " NASCAR DAD" President has returned back from Florida from spending his week-end at the Daytona 500, how are the Democrats going to win one Southern State against Bush when Kerry is the Yankee for " Gay marriage". Believe me, as a man who lives in the South. Kerry will lose every Southern State including Florida just as Gore did. And Gore was from the South and not running against a Social Issue as explosive as " Gay marriage". So now you have a choice. Vote for a Southern Senator from North Carolina who is totally against Civil Unions and Gay Marriage and has incredible charisma and charm or Vote for a Yankee who will lose against Bush.
PS: I believe in Civil Unions and equal rights for all Americans, But I believe in beating Bush even more. I also have a cousin I care about who's openly gay and entered into a Civil Union last August.
Dear Edwards operative
I can't consider the candidate who paid you to smear Kerry for. I don't like the Patriot act - Edwards wrote it.
http://edwards.senate.gov/press/2001/oct26-pr.html
"This will strengthen our nation's ability to prevent future terrorist attacks," said Senator John Edwards, who worked on the legislation as a member of the Judiciary Committee and the Select Committee on Intelligence.
I don't like this war. Edwards would have started it himself.
MATTHEWS: OK. I just want to get one thing straight so that we know how you would have been different in president if you had been in office the last four years as president. Would you have gone to Afghanistan?
EDWARDS: I would.
MATTHEWS: Would you have gone to Iraq?
EDWARDS: I would have gone to Iraq.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3131295/
I'm sticking with Clark's choice.
Have a nice day!
Dear Clark Supporter,
As an original Draft Clark movement member, I'm writing to tell you why Bush and Carl Rove's $ 200 Million Smear Machine will destroy Kerry in November. First off, Kerry has a 19 Year Voting Record in the Senate that is going to be twisted and distorted and smeared against him. For example, Kerry Voted FOR NAFTA and many other controversial issues that now he's against. Secondly the Republicans are already running attack ads across the Nation against Kerry pointing out how he accepted enormous amounts of Special interest money over his 19 year Senate career, much more than almost every Senator that has ever served. If you've been watching the news lately you will have noticed that the " Gay Marriage " issue has exploded and is now a huge SOCIAL ISSUE that Bush will be using to his advantage, especially in the South. For the past 3 weeks Republicans have been on TV saying that Kerry is more liberal than his fellow Senator from Massachusetts Ted Kennedy. Their going to love telling Americans how Kerry is the Senator from Massachusetts where they have already passed laws allowing " Gay Marriage ". Every Democrat President who has won the White House in American history has had to win at the VERY LEAST 5 Southern States. That's 1,2,3,4,5 SOUTHERN STATES. Bill Clinton did it and so did JFK. Al Gore lost every one of them. There are already newspapers all over the South that are saying that Kerry is FOR " GAY MARRIAGE ". That's a quote, they don't say Civil Unions which Kerry is on the record as being for. They're saying " GAY MARRIAGE ". Just try explaining to a Southerner the difference between Civil Unions and Gay Marriage. YOU CAN'T. It's all the same to them. Now that our " NASCAR DAD" President has returned back from Florida from spending his week-end at the Daytona 500, how are the Democrats going to win one Southern State against Bush when Kerry is the Yankee for " Gay marriage". Believe me, as a man who lives in the South. Kerry will lose every Southern State including Florida just as Gore did. And Gore was from the South and not running against a Social Issue as explosive as " Gay marriage". So now you have a choice. Vote for a Southern Senator from North Carolina who is totally against Civil Unions and Gay Marriage and has incredible charisma and charm or Vote for a Yankee who will lose against Bush.
PS: I believe in Civil Unions and equal rights for all Americans, But I believe in beating Bush even more. I also have a cousin I care about who's openly gay and entered into a Civil Union last August.
Dear Edwards operative
I can't consider the candidate who paid you to smear Kerry for. I don't like the Patriot act - Edwards wrote it.
http://edwards.senate.gov/press/2001/oct26-pr.html
"This will strengthen our nation's ability to prevent future terrorist attacks," said Senator John Edwards, who worked on the legislation as a member of the Judiciary Committee and the Select Committee on Intelligence.
I don't like this war. Edwards would have started it himself.
MATTHEWS: OK. I just want to get one thing straight so that we know how you would have been different in president if you had been in office the last four years as president. Would you have gone to Afghanistan?
EDWARDS: I would.
MATTHEWS: Would you have gone to Iraq?
EDWARDS: I would have gone to Iraq.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3131295/
I'm sticking with Clark's choice.
Have a nice day!
Wednesday, February 18, 2004
for those who missed Novak's finest moment, it was when he interviewed Mary Steenburgen and Ted Danson the week of the deserter nonsense. his first question to Mary: "So what do you make of Clark saying that Bush was a deserter?" and she rightly said, "first of all, I don't agree with the spin you put on it. Moore said it, not Clark." he said nothing. and if you think the producers should have walked out and fired him on the spot for that, the last question was for Ted about the previous night's top ten list on Dave Letterman. With a straight face he asked Danson to explain the clip of Dean giving the number 4 way he would reinvigorate his campaign: "I'm going to get Ted Danson to back my campaign and do that thing he does". what did he mean by that, Mr. Danson? Instead of saying, look you, dumb fucking asshole and emabarrasment to all journalists everywhere, it's the letterman top ten list which we all know is nothing but a silly list of jokes!! Why the hell are we having this discussion?!" he just said, "I don't know what it means....but I like it."
"We'll Follow the Old Man'
We'll follow the old man wherever he wants to go
As long as he wants to go opposite to the foe
We'll stay with the old man wherever he wants to stay
As long he stays away from the battle's fray
Because we love him, we love him
Especially when he keeps us on the ball
And we'll tell the kiddies we answer duties' call
With the grandest son of a soldier of them all
Attention! Attention!
Gee, I wish I was back in the army
The army wasn't really bad at all
Three meals a day for which you didn't pay
Uniforms for winter, spring and fall
There's a lot to be said for the army
The life without responsibility
A soldier out of luck was never really stuck
There's always someone higher up where you can pass the buck
Oh, gee, I wish I was back in the army
Gee, I wish I was back in the army
The army was the place to find romance
Soldiers and WAC's the WAC's who dressed in slacks
Dancing cheek to cheek and pants to pants
There's a lot to be said for the army
The best of doctors watched you carefully
A dentist and a clerk, for weeks and weeks they'd work
They make a thousand dollar job and give it to a jerk
Oh, gee, I wish I was back in the army
Three meals a day for which you didn't pay
I thought that I was through with all my care and strife
But after months and months of the civilian life
Gee, I wish I was back in the army now!
We'll follow the old man wherever he wants to go
As long as he wants to go opposite to the foe
We'll stay with the old man wherever he wants to stay
As long he stays away from the battle's fray
Because we love him, we love him
Especially when he keeps us on the ball
And we'll tell the kiddies we answer duties' call
With the grandest son of a soldier of them all
Attention! Attention!
Gee, I wish I was back in the army
The army wasn't really bad at all
Three meals a day for which you didn't pay
Uniforms for winter, spring and fall
There's a lot to be said for the army
The life without responsibility
A soldier out of luck was never really stuck
There's always someone higher up where you can pass the buck
Oh, gee, I wish I was back in the army
Gee, I wish I was back in the army
The army was the place to find romance
Soldiers and WAC's the WAC's who dressed in slacks
Dancing cheek to cheek and pants to pants
There's a lot to be said for the army
The best of doctors watched you carefully
A dentist and a clerk, for weeks and weeks they'd work
They make a thousand dollar job and give it to a jerk
Oh, gee, I wish I was back in the army
Three meals a day for which you didn't pay
I thought that I was through with all my care and strife
But after months and months of the civilian life
Gee, I wish I was back in the army now!
A Message from Wes Clark
February 18, 2004
Dear Leah,
I can't thank you enough for all the support you've shown my family
and me over the past 5 months, and especially in the last week since
my decision to leave the presidential race. Your emails, letters,
and phone calls have meant a lot to Gert and me.
Right now, we're looking forward to a little time off. Today, Gert
and I are flying to Los Angeles to spend the next week with Wes,
Astrid, and my new grandson. During the next few weeks, I'll be
reflecting a lot on all that we've done together and putting together
some ideas about where we will go from here.
For many of us, this was our first time to really get involved in
politics. I think we all learned a lot, and I hope you feel as I do:
even more inspired to do whatever it takes to build a better America.
My pledge to you is to remain involved in the political process. And
I ask you to do the same, because there is just too much at stake
this election.
We cannot allow George W. Bush and the Republicans to play politics
with national security.
We must reclaim the values of faith, family, patriotism, and
inclusive leadership for America.
We must do everything in our power to send George W. Bush back to
Texas and return the White House to its rightful owner -- the
American people.
In short, I ask you to stick with me and support the Democratic
nominee. There is a long road ahead and a lot of work to do. I'll be
back in touch soon with ideas about how we can continue to work
together and spread our message across America. If you have any
thoughts you'd like to share, please email me at wesclark@clark04.com.
I look forward to continuing to work with you to build a better
America.
Best regards,
Wes Clark
P.S. To minimize any confusion during this transition period, all
communications about my future plans, fundraising, and any other
official information will come directly from me. As always, you also
will be able to find this information on our official website,
www.clark04.com.
February 18, 2004
Dear Leah,
I can't thank you enough for all the support you've shown my family
and me over the past 5 months, and especially in the last week since
my decision to leave the presidential race. Your emails, letters,
and phone calls have meant a lot to Gert and me.
Right now, we're looking forward to a little time off. Today, Gert
and I are flying to Los Angeles to spend the next week with Wes,
Astrid, and my new grandson. During the next few weeks, I'll be
reflecting a lot on all that we've done together and putting together
some ideas about where we will go from here.
For many of us, this was our first time to really get involved in
politics. I think we all learned a lot, and I hope you feel as I do:
even more inspired to do whatever it takes to build a better America.
My pledge to you is to remain involved in the political process. And
I ask you to do the same, because there is just too much at stake
this election.
We cannot allow George W. Bush and the Republicans to play politics
with national security.
We must reclaim the values of faith, family, patriotism, and
inclusive leadership for America.
We must do everything in our power to send George W. Bush back to
Texas and return the White House to its rightful owner -- the
American people.
In short, I ask you to stick with me and support the Democratic
nominee. There is a long road ahead and a lot of work to do. I'll be
back in touch soon with ideas about how we can continue to work
together and spread our message across America. If you have any
thoughts you'd like to share, please email me at wesclark@clark04.com.
I look forward to continuing to work with you to build a better
America.
Best regards,
Wes Clark
P.S. To minimize any confusion during this transition period, all
communications about my future plans, fundraising, and any other
official information will come directly from me. As always, you also
will be able to find this information on our official website,
www.clark04.com.
(#280) (Rated 5.00/3)
by Donna Z on 02/17/2004 11:35:13 PM EST
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First a big hug and a "thank you" to Robbed for the report. Now for my thoughts:
What we know:
1. We don't know what happened between Clark's farewell speech and the following morning when it was announced that he was endorsing Kerry, but it is safe to say something did happen.
2. Wes considers Kerry a friend.
3. The campaign staff has been dismantled
4. Wes will be speaking around the country, for Kerry and on Kerry's dime, on the subject of the war...and foreign policy.
5. Sooner or later the room we are transmitting from will be closed because ain't nobody paying the rent.
6. Wes loves technology, loves the concept of electronic townmeetings--blogs, and ran one on "Leadership for America."
7. Wesley Clark is swimming with sharks. I'm sure he is aware of this, but he believes for himself and for us: never be afraid.
____What is up in the air____
1. We don't know what was offered, if anything, to Wes in exchange for the endorsement. Personally, I don't think much of anything because Wes is now on a mission to A ) dump bush B) stop the war C ) restore America's status in the world. While I think this group and the blog are important to him, I doubt that they are paramount at this point in time. Eventually, yes. Now...it is up in the air.
2. We don't know what Clinton is up to. I always thought the connection was not as strong as the media makes it out to be. Seriously, I'm sure Clinton likes Wesley very much and respects him, but Clinton likes Clinton much more.
This thread is probably dead now, so I'll continue later.
by Donna Z on 02/17/2004 11:35:13 PM EST
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First a big hug and a "thank you" to Robbed for the report. Now for my thoughts:
What we know:
1. We don't know what happened between Clark's farewell speech and the following morning when it was announced that he was endorsing Kerry, but it is safe to say something did happen.
2. Wes considers Kerry a friend.
3. The campaign staff has been dismantled
4. Wes will be speaking around the country, for Kerry and on Kerry's dime, on the subject of the war...and foreign policy.
5. Sooner or later the room we are transmitting from will be closed because ain't nobody paying the rent.
6. Wes loves technology, loves the concept of electronic townmeetings--blogs, and ran one on "Leadership for America."
7. Wesley Clark is swimming with sharks. I'm sure he is aware of this, but he believes for himself and for us: never be afraid.
____What is up in the air____
1. We don't know what was offered, if anything, to Wes in exchange for the endorsement. Personally, I don't think much of anything because Wes is now on a mission to A ) dump bush B) stop the war C ) restore America's status in the world. While I think this group and the blog are important to him, I doubt that they are paramount at this point in time. Eventually, yes. Now...it is up in the air.
2. We don't know what Clinton is up to. I always thought the connection was not as strong as the media makes it out to be. Seriously, I'm sure Clinton likes Wesley very much and respects him, but Clinton likes Clinton much more.
This thread is probably dead now, so I'll continue later.
Tuesday, February 17, 2004
Catherine
I agree with Leah.....
I followed the press very closely since September 17th...
Even gave a speech on the power of the media and elections (so prophetic looking back, I scare myself)...during the Clark candidacy announcement celebration in the EastBay (CA)
....it was filmed (I signed the release).
The media, this time round, was bolder than I had ever expected.....
Ask yourselves, before placing blame on Clark........
How is it that we went to war in Iraq?
Millions all over the world, including in the US....took to the streets to say NO.
The French said NO, the Germans said NO, the Russians said NO, Mexico said NO, Canada said NO, The United Nations said NO, the Weapons Inspectors said NO, heck even more had said NO in the US initially......
...but we went....
How could that be?
I remember the media reporting on French wine being spilled into the streets....I remember the media reporting everyword that maligned the UN....I remember the big news story and the ridicule..the French Fries renamed, the jokes on Jay Leno....I remember it all.
How did we allow the impeachment of the sitting President (Clinton) when times were really good?
How did we allow the Florida mess to be decided in the Supreme Court.....and then were told to get over it?
How did California elect a Governor like Arnold?
If you answered the media....then you understand that they are the ones who decide......we do not.
If the nominee was decided because of electibility.....ask yourselves why Clark is not still left standing instead of Edwards..........This is not about how Clark campaigned......this is about who was chosen for us.
Maybe blaming the media is frightening, because we have so little power against it........
But that's who's running things primarily...whether we want to accept it or not.
----- Original Message -----
From: Leah Faerstein
To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: [UnitedForClark] Re: Grassroots and professionals
Look
if you want to blame Clark for what the media did to him, you lost me.
people have a duty to get informed. He went to town halls. put it on the website, went to debate, had press conferences and terrific speeches. Your eyes glazed over - your loss and also the loss of the people in this country. Your brain: use it or lose it. Rove played all dems who refused to think - please don't blame Clark for this.
We don't have a democracy anymore, our voices are not allowed in the political discourse. And when I say "our" I mean Clark as well. THEY pick whose voice gets heard.
I lived under a dictatorship once - this looks pretty close.
You fail to see the signs, your right. Just don't blame the one guy who tried to tear the system down for the system's faults.
Too bad you didn't listen to Clark. You might have heard this:
Drawing loud cheers, Clark called the Bush White House the "most closed, secretive, nasty administration" he knew of. "I think they're a threat to democracy itself with its control of the media."
"the media's shutting out voices of dissent in this country."
Wes Clark
I agree with Leah.....
I followed the press very closely since September 17th...
Even gave a speech on the power of the media and elections (so prophetic looking back, I scare myself)...during the Clark candidacy announcement celebration in the EastBay (CA)
....it was filmed (I signed the release).
The media, this time round, was bolder than I had ever expected.....
Ask yourselves, before placing blame on Clark........
How is it that we went to war in Iraq?
Millions all over the world, including in the US....took to the streets to say NO.
The French said NO, the Germans said NO, the Russians said NO, Mexico said NO, Canada said NO, The United Nations said NO, the Weapons Inspectors said NO, heck even more had said NO in the US initially......
...but we went....
How could that be?
I remember the media reporting on French wine being spilled into the streets....I remember the media reporting everyword that maligned the UN....I remember the big news story and the ridicule..the French Fries renamed, the jokes on Jay Leno....I remember it all.
How did we allow the impeachment of the sitting President (Clinton) when times were really good?
How did we allow the Florida mess to be decided in the Supreme Court.....and then were told to get over it?
How did California elect a Governor like Arnold?
If you answered the media....then you understand that they are the ones who decide......we do not.
If the nominee was decided because of electibility.....ask yourselves why Clark is not still left standing instead of Edwards..........This is not about how Clark campaigned......this is about who was chosen for us.
Maybe blaming the media is frightening, because we have so little power against it........
But that's who's running things primarily...whether we want to accept it or not.
----- Original Message -----
From: Leah Faerstein
To: UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: [UnitedForClark] Re: Grassroots and professionals
Look
if you want to blame Clark for what the media did to him, you lost me.
people have a duty to get informed. He went to town halls. put it on the website, went to debate, had press conferences and terrific speeches. Your eyes glazed over - your loss and also the loss of the people in this country. Your brain: use it or lose it. Rove played all dems who refused to think - please don't blame Clark for this.
We don't have a democracy anymore, our voices are not allowed in the political discourse. And when I say "our" I mean Clark as well. THEY pick whose voice gets heard.
I lived under a dictatorship once - this looks pretty close.
You fail to see the signs, your right. Just don't blame the one guy who tried to tear the system down for the system's faults.
Too bad you didn't listen to Clark. You might have heard this:
Drawing loud cheers, Clark called the Bush White House the "most closed, secretive, nasty administration" he knew of. "I think they're a threat to democracy itself with its control of the media."
"the media's shutting out voices of dissent in this country."
Wes Clark
(#239) (Rated 4.66/3)
by Anonymous on 02/17/2004 02:41:46 PM EST
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Please! Let's just say it! He is gorgeous! My mother and I went to a rally in NH to see the General and when he took the stage, I was a little taken aback by his presence and good looks, my mother said "My God, he is handsome." and the lady sitting next to me let out a little "Wow."
He is DEFINITELY a package deal. I can't wait to see him again when I volunteer here in Boston at the Convention...cause he will be here. ;)
by Anonymous on 02/17/2004 02:41:46 PM EST
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Please! Let's just say it! He is gorgeous! My mother and I went to a rally in NH to see the General and when he took the stage, I was a little taken aback by his presence and good looks, my mother said "My God, he is handsome." and the lady sitting next to me let out a little "Wow."
He is DEFINITELY a package deal. I can't wait to see him again when I volunteer here in Boston at the Convention...cause he will be here. ;)
(#252) (No rating)
by RuthBenedict (RuthBenedict at forclark dot com) on 02/17/2004 02:48:32 PM EST
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Philly: I loved the argyle sweater, but that's just me! Personally, my dream outfit on Wes would be just a pair of jeans and a smile. (Beverage of my choice included.)
Dated Wes, lived with Wes, married Wes, honeymooned with Wes and the honeymoon will never end!
by RuthBenedict (RuthBenedict at forclark dot com) on 02/17/2004 02:48:32 PM EST
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Philly: I loved the argyle sweater, but that's just me! Personally, my dream outfit on Wes would be just a pair of jeans and a smile. (Beverage of my choice included.)
Dated Wes, lived with Wes, married Wes, honeymooned with Wes and the honeymoon will never end!
At the risk of redundancy,
Kerry folks, please do not ask us for time/visibility/talent. You will find, that as a rule and to a very large extent, we are professionals, thinkers, and evaluators, who don't jump on bandwagons, rather we base our loyalty on investigation and research. We transcend party and we transcend politics. We have been given our preliminary marching orders, and will follow them to the letter. When additional orders come down from General Clark, we will follow those orders, to the letter. Why will we follow those orders? are we blind lemmings? Far from it. A Clark supporter (Ice) developed an MPEG based on the song "We'll Follow the Old Man" I believe its an old WW II song. People sung that song, not because the officer that they were singing it about ordered them to, or because of "group think" they sung it, and we sing it, for one reason.. General Clark has earned our respect, he did not pay for it, he did not stump for it, he didn't give speeches for it. Kerry folks, understand this and understand it clearly and unambiguously, We are supporters of General Clark because he has earned our respect. We will follow the old man. That loyalty is non-transferable. Now stop trying to recruit us, we will do what we must, when the time comes.
Respectfully,
Cynthia Marie Klenk, (Proudly out at the pointy end of the spear in Clarks Army, Portage des Sioux, MO.
Kerry folks, please do not ask us for time/visibility/talent. You will find, that as a rule and to a very large extent, we are professionals, thinkers, and evaluators, who don't jump on bandwagons, rather we base our loyalty on investigation and research. We transcend party and we transcend politics. We have been given our preliminary marching orders, and will follow them to the letter. When additional orders come down from General Clark, we will follow those orders, to the letter. Why will we follow those orders? are we blind lemmings? Far from it. A Clark supporter (Ice) developed an MPEG based on the song "We'll Follow the Old Man" I believe its an old WW II song. People sung that song, not because the officer that they were singing it about ordered them to, or because of "group think" they sung it, and we sing it, for one reason.. General Clark has earned our respect, he did not pay for it, he did not stump for it, he didn't give speeches for it. Kerry folks, understand this and understand it clearly and unambiguously, We are supporters of General Clark because he has earned our respect. We will follow the old man. That loyalty is non-transferable. Now stop trying to recruit us, we will do what we must, when the time comes.
Respectfully,
Cynthia Marie Klenk, (Proudly out at the pointy end of the spear in Clarks Army, Portage des Sioux, MO.
BS! I was in NH when Clark had a conference call with his stuff/all of us volunteers. Clark ran every aspect of the NH campaign =- canvassing - numbers, details stories, who did what. All that from the Green Room of MTP - while waiting to be interviewed.
I don't care what competition existed in the campaign, Clark ran the whole thing efficiently.
Please, STOP BUYING THE SPIN!
The only reason it's Kerry and not us is because he got the coverage, the party machine and Rove's blessings. We were at the wrong end of all these things.
It was never meant to be a primary election. GOP-ers went for dean (civil unions) and switched to Kerry (gay marriage). DNC as usual, bent over. Case closed.
I don't care what competition existed in the campaign, Clark ran the whole thing efficiently.
Please, STOP BUYING THE SPIN!
The only reason it's Kerry and not us is because he got the coverage, the party machine and Rove's blessings. We were at the wrong end of all these things.
It was never meant to be a primary election. GOP-ers went for dean (civil unions) and switched to Kerry (gay marriage). DNC as usual, bent over. Case closed.
(#117) (Rated 5.00/1)
by Kramer (Kramer at forclark dot com) on 02/17/2004 01:54:13 PM EST
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Well, we were doing well in cash, but it was CASH FLOW that was the problem...due mostly in part to the FEC matching funds that were promised, but never arrived.
I still think our General did the best thing for his future, and our future.
Would we really want to be marginalized along the same likes of the Deaniacs? They look just plain silly right now.
General Clark has grace, and he saw the writing on the wall. No amount of paid media can combat the free media being received by Kerry (and Edwards--you would think the media is in love with him--remember how he was considered such a contender by them back in November, yet he was polling under 5% ?).
by Kramer (Kramer at forclark dot com) on 02/17/2004 01:54:13 PM EST
Rate this: - 1 2 3 4 5 + | Parent | Reply
Well, we were doing well in cash, but it was CASH FLOW that was the problem...due mostly in part to the FEC matching funds that were promised, but never arrived.
I still think our General did the best thing for his future, and our future.
Would we really want to be marginalized along the same likes of the Deaniacs? They look just plain silly right now.
General Clark has grace, and he saw the writing on the wall. No amount of paid media can combat the free media being received by Kerry (and Edwards--you would think the media is in love with him--remember how he was considered such a contender by them back in November, yet he was polling under 5% ?).
[new] (#143) (No rating)
by Cat M on 02/17/2004 02:04:20 PM EST
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After peeking in at all the various' candidates blogs, I noticed one consensus issue--
all the blogs had negative remarks about Terry McAuliffe. I think he needs to resign. I saw a recent poll that indicated over 75% of democrats were unhappy with the primary process.
Democrats just don't seem to trust him, in my opinion. I don't like how things have been handled. I can't believe we have no process for excluding candidates who poll at less than 2% nationally from the debates. I like Dennis Kucinich and I think Sharpton is a hoot, but having to give equal share to candidates who can't reach 2% after 12 primaries limits our ability to make a real choice between viable candidates. It's frustrating.
by Cat M on 02/17/2004 02:04:20 PM EST
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After peeking in at all the various' candidates blogs, I noticed one consensus issue--
all the blogs had negative remarks about Terry McAuliffe. I think he needs to resign. I saw a recent poll that indicated over 75% of democrats were unhappy with the primary process.
Democrats just don't seem to trust him, in my opinion. I don't like how things have been handled. I can't believe we have no process for excluding candidates who poll at less than 2% nationally from the debates. I like Dennis Kucinich and I think Sharpton is a hoot, but having to give equal share to candidates who can't reach 2% after 12 primaries limits our ability to make a real choice between viable candidates. It's frustrating.
Here's some spit and vinegar:
"I am so thoroughly disgusted with the DNC and the DLC's attacks on Gov. Dean and the coronation of John Kerry by your talking heads, even though the vast majority of those voting for him don't care for his record or his policies. YOU have dragged this election into the gutter. YOU have BETRAYED the Democratic Base. YOU are the reason that more and more TRUE DEMOCRATS are LEAVING THE PARTY. YOU have manipulated the news to your benefit, excluding MILLIONS. MY VOICE IS MY OWN, and YOU WILL NOT USURP IT. I am not a rubber stamp for your talking heads. I have voted Democratic for most of my life, and given contributions in the past. Your failure to stand up for the rights of the PEOPLE to choose THEIR candidate stinks as badly as Florida 2000. I will NOT support the DNC/DLC financially or with my volunteer efforts. I will choose MY candidates and donate to them DIRECTLY with a check endorsed with a memo stating that the donation is made from a supporter of Gov. Howard Dean. YOU DON'T SPEAK FOR ME."
"I am so thoroughly disgusted with the DNC and the DLC's attacks on Gov. Dean and the coronation of John Kerry by your talking heads, even though the vast majority of those voting for him don't care for his record or his policies. YOU have dragged this election into the gutter. YOU have BETRAYED the Democratic Base. YOU are the reason that more and more TRUE DEMOCRATS are LEAVING THE PARTY. YOU have manipulated the news to your benefit, excluding MILLIONS. MY VOICE IS MY OWN, and YOU WILL NOT USURP IT. I am not a rubber stamp for your talking heads. I have voted Democratic for most of my life, and given contributions in the past. Your failure to stand up for the rights of the PEOPLE to choose THEIR candidate stinks as badly as Florida 2000. I will NOT support the DNC/DLC financially or with my volunteer efforts. I will choose MY candidates and donate to them DIRECTLY with a check endorsed with a memo stating that the donation is made from a supporter of Gov. Howard Dean. YOU DON'T SPEAK FOR ME."
(#50) (Rated 5.00/1)
by Donna Z on 02/17/2004 01:26:17 PM EST
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If you ever find the link I would suggest taking a close look at the body language. The General is turned to the side and presents a limited target, while Dean is straight on. The contex of the picture is also interesting. Shortly before the break during which this was taken, Dean had been exercising his yadi-yadi-I'm the only person on this stage who opposed the war-schpill. At that point Clark slid from his stool, smiling the entire time, and folds his arms across his chest while keeping both feet on the ground and leaning on the stool with his entire body in a straight line. (I hope you can see what I'm saying.) Anyway, the moment the break was called, the General, in one fluid movement, was upright, turning and moving toward Dean, thus being the first person there with no exit for the governor.
Sometimes one forgets that Clark was trained as a ranger, but that moment and the body language in the resulting still picture, should serve to remind us.
http://gallery.clark04.com/albums/110203rtv/clark_04_1.sized.jpg
by Donna Z on 02/17/2004 01:26:17 PM EST
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If you ever find the link I would suggest taking a close look at the body language. The General is turned to the side and presents a limited target, while Dean is straight on. The contex of the picture is also interesting. Shortly before the break during which this was taken, Dean had been exercising his yadi-yadi-I'm the only person on this stage who opposed the war-schpill. At that point Clark slid from his stool, smiling the entire time, and folds his arms across his chest while keeping both feet on the ground and leaning on the stool with his entire body in a straight line. (I hope you can see what I'm saying.) Anyway, the moment the break was called, the General, in one fluid movement, was upright, turning and moving toward Dean, thus being the first person there with no exit for the governor.
Sometimes one forgets that Clark was trained as a ranger, but that moment and the body language in the resulting still picture, should serve to remind us.
http://gallery.clark04.com/albums/110203rtv/clark_04_1.sized.jpg
new] (#169) (No rating)
by Ocelot on 02/17/2004 11:22:40 AM EST
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Anybody had a peek at DFA lately? They're sorta decompensating over there. Lots of grenade throwing, as well as collecting feathers and boiling up a batch of tar for their guy who just left the campaign to work for Kerry. Gotta feel sorry for them, though, even though many of them have been total @$$holes to us -- they've been working for Dean for almost 2 years; looked for awhile like he was the "anointed" front-runner, then the rug got pulled out from under them. It has to suck. They say he won't drop out now regardless of what happens in WI, but we'll see.
by Ocelot on 02/17/2004 11:22:40 AM EST
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Anybody had a peek at DFA lately? They're sorta decompensating over there. Lots of grenade throwing, as well as collecting feathers and boiling up a batch of tar for their guy who just left the campaign to work for Kerry. Gotta feel sorry for them, though, even though many of them have been total @$$holes to us -- they've been working for Dean for almost 2 years; looked for awhile like he was the "anointed" front-runner, then the rug got pulled out from under them. It has to suck. They say he won't drop out now regardless of what happens in WI, but we'll see.
Chuck, the point has never been that Wesley Clark never made a single
mistake. The point is that EVERY politician, no matter how seasoned
and "professional" makes mistakes. They're all human. Alex noticed
the white spittle in the corner of Kerry's mouth at the televised
banquet. And God knows we've seen him bore an audience to tears.
Dean referred to the Soviet Union reigning Iran's nuclear
development, three times, on Hardball. Edwards, as slick as he is,
only has one stump speech, and remember his misstatements in the NH
debate?
But only Wes Clark's mistakes were replayed over and over, and
questioned again and again (well, until Dean made his scream). And
only Wes Clark's successes were completely ignored. The media
decided that he was an inept campaigner, and then they presented the
evidence to confirm the image they had decided to portray.
mistake. The point is that EVERY politician, no matter how seasoned
and "professional" makes mistakes. They're all human. Alex noticed
the white spittle in the corner of Kerry's mouth at the televised
banquet. And God knows we've seen him bore an audience to tears.
Dean referred to the Soviet Union reigning Iran's nuclear
development, three times, on Hardball. Edwards, as slick as he is,
only has one stump speech, and remember his misstatements in the NH
debate?
But only Wes Clark's mistakes were replayed over and over, and
questioned again and again (well, until Dean made his scream). And
only Wes Clark's successes were completely ignored. The media
decided that he was an inept campaigner, and then they presented the
evidence to confirm the image they had decided to portray.
Catherine
To be honest, I'm not sure why it was....but there was a reason allright.......The facts are that he was never much discussed in the pundit circles. Even when they were talking about the anti-Dean....it was always Gephardt.....never Clark. It wasn't until the first week in January that they lightly decided that Clark "might" be the anti Dean.....after that it was "look at his poll numbers (Clark's), they are falling, falling".....they talked him down, they did.
But to be sure, Clark was ALWAYS left out of pundit conversations about nominees and the race....except a few, very few, times. I remember because I was always so surprised when they would refuse to speak his name, as I was waiting to hear it. I remember writing to Bill Press about it. He said that Dean was the man!....with the money and the grassroots..... Wrote to Tom Curry about it (MSNBC), he said Dean had the Money, the organization and the grassroots........I wrote to Donna Brazile....she said Clark should not have opt out of Iowa......
So go figure....maybe it was the Clinton thing with the press, maybe it was as you suggest because Clark was a new Democrat, maybe it was because many knew that Clark could beat Bush so easily there would be no fun in it, maybe it was because Kerry was the chosen DNC/DLC candidate and they were not going to talk up Clark, maybe he was to prove what he could do with no help, maybe it was because he started late...and they thought..."how dare he".......maybe, maybe, maybe.....
So many reasons....none which really seem to take democracy into consideration.
Anyways, there certainly was a reason(s)...I just have not been made privy as to what it was....yet.
Monday, February 16, 2004
Leah
You are definitely a jewel in the Clark Crown. This whole group is in my opinion. I am convinced that together we could be a political force to be reckoned with. I have been thinking about this for days now and I have a plan but I'm very hesitant to present it especially since the General hasn't let us know how we can best serve him in the political arena. Would you be a willing ear to listen to what I want to present to the group. I would really appreciate an opinion from someone who has been with the group so long and who I believe would be honest with me. Please don't feel obligated or bad about saying no. I'm kind of worried about the reactions I will get if my idea only sounds good in my own head. I want to present it to Susan A but someone else seeing it first might save me some embarrasment.
Thanks for listening
Maria
You are definitely a jewel in the Clark Crown. This whole group is in my opinion. I am convinced that together we could be a political force to be reckoned with. I have been thinking about this for days now and I have a plan but I'm very hesitant to present it especially since the General hasn't let us know how we can best serve him in the political arena. Would you be a willing ear to listen to what I want to present to the group. I would really appreciate an opinion from someone who has been with the group so long and who I believe would be honest with me. Please don't feel obligated or bad about saying no. I'm kind of worried about the reactions I will get if my idea only sounds good in my own head. I want to present it to Susan A but someone else seeing it first might save me some embarrasment.
Thanks for listening
Maria
(#169) (Rated 5.00/1)
by ElizabethEnglish on 02/16/2004 10:50:36 PM EST
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You know, if Wes is offered and takes VP position, he really does alot to make Kerry look better.
It's like Wes has this extra, extra large personality and grace, and when he is near Kerry, Kerry looks more alive and dare I say "attractive" in the sense that he at least doesn't resemble Lurch as much.
Remember in American Son when Wes talks about his father and says "he had a huge personality that filled the room" or at least a comment very near to that.
So, if it is Kerry/Clark, at least Kerry will be easier on the eye with Wes around....at least to me.
Elizabeth in Greensboro
by ElizabethEnglish on 02/16/2004 10:50:36 PM EST
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You know, if Wes is offered and takes VP position, he really does alot to make Kerry look better.
It's like Wes has this extra, extra large personality and grace, and when he is near Kerry, Kerry looks more alive and dare I say "attractive" in the sense that he at least doesn't resemble Lurch as much.
Remember in American Son when Wes talks about his father and says "he had a huge personality that filled the room" or at least a comment very near to that.
So, if it is Kerry/Clark, at least Kerry will be easier on the eye with Wes around....at least to me.
Elizabeth in Greensboro
(#70) (Rated 5.00/1)
by DanD on 02/16/2004 09:51:22 PM EST
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Ranier - You are lucky. 7 months later, I find that all the reasons I left the Kerry camp are still there. I just keep reminding myself, he's better than Bush. Problem is the stuff the cat left in my yard is better than Bush, so that's not much of a selling point.
by DanD on 02/16/2004 09:51:22 PM EST
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Ranier - You are lucky. 7 months later, I find that all the reasons I left the Kerry camp are still there. I just keep reminding myself, he's better than Bush. Problem is the stuff the cat left in my yard is better than Bush, so that's not much of a selling point.
--- In UnitedForClark@yahoogroups.com, "Michael"
wrote:
Clark would be the best choice for VP because he would have been the
best choice for President.
I don't think it can get any simpler than that.
________________________
Excellent. Elegant. Elegiac. Please let them know or else I will steal it from
you, Michael:
http://www.democrats.org/contact/
Clark would be the best choice for VP because he would have been the
best choice for President.
I don't think it can get any simpler than that.
________________________
Excellent. Elegant. Elegiac. Please let them know or else I will steal it from
you, Michael
http://www.democrats.org/contact/
In Search of a Running Mate
If not Edwards, then who? On the basis of pulling weight around the
country, three figures appear to be in the top tier of candidates,
though no one is near having a lock on it.
First is Clark, a retired four-star general and former NATO supreme
commander. He and his campaign hit hard at Kerry early in his
campaign, and he is said to have infuriated Kerry by at one point
claiming his military expertise was vastly superior because he had
been a general where Kerry had served in Vietnam only as a lowly,
though highly decorated, lieutenant.
But Clark wasted no time at all in enthusiastically endorsing Kerry
right after he pulled out of the race last week, and his team is said
to have already put out feelers to the Kerry camp on the running-mate
question.
Clark could bring several attractive qualities to the Kerry campaign.
He would offer clout in his native Arkansas, a crucial, traditionally
Democratic state that would have given the presidency to Al Gore had
he won it in the last election.
Clark also has shown his best strength in crucial heartland states
such as Oklahoma and Tennessee that Kerry early would love to win. If
Kerry proves determined not to take Edwards, then Clark easily is the
most eminent and promising Southern candidate for the No. 2 spot.
Further, a Kerry-Clark ticket would offer the Democrats the truly
enticing prospect of not one but two highly decorated Vietnam heroes
on the ticket, something that no party has ever had before. That would
truly twist the knife in the most telling contrast Kerry has been able
to establish between himself and Bush: what they both did or did not
do in that war.
http://tinyurl.com/2docp
http://www.insightmag.com/news/2004/03/02/Politics/In.Search.Of.A.Running.Mate-608644.shtml
If not Edwards, then who? On the basis of pulling weight around the
country, three figures appear to be in the top tier of candidates,
though no one is near having a lock on it.
First is Clark, a retired four-star general and former NATO supreme
commander. He and his campaign hit hard at Kerry early in his
campaign, and he is said to have infuriated Kerry by at one point
claiming his military expertise was vastly superior because he had
been a general where Kerry had served in Vietnam only as a lowly,
though highly decorated, lieutenant.
But Clark wasted no time at all in enthusiastically endorsing Kerry
right after he pulled out of the race last week, and his team is said
to have already put out feelers to the Kerry camp on the running-mate
question.
Clark could bring several attractive qualities to the Kerry campaign.
He would offer clout in his native Arkansas, a crucial, traditionally
Democratic state that would have given the presidency to Al Gore had
he won it in the last election.
Clark also has shown his best strength in crucial heartland states
such as Oklahoma and Tennessee that Kerry early would love to win. If
Kerry proves determined not to take Edwards, then Clark easily is the
most eminent and promising Southern candidate for the No. 2 spot.
Further, a Kerry-Clark ticket would offer the Democrats the truly
enticing prospect of not one but two highly decorated Vietnam heroes
on the ticket, something that no party has ever had before. That would
truly twist the knife in the most telling contrast Kerry has been able
to establish between himself and Bush: what they both did or did not
do in that war.
http://tinyurl.com/2docp
http://www.insightmag.com/news/2004/03/02/Politics/In.Search.Of.A.Running.Mate-608644.shtml
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